flux changed the topic of #ocaml to: Discussions about the OCaml programming language | http://www.ocaml.org | OCaml MOOC http://1149.fr/ocaml-mooc | OCaml 4.03.0 announced http://ocaml.org/releases/4.03.html | Try OCaml in your browser: http://try.ocamlpro.com | Public channel logs at http://irclog.whitequark.org/ocaml
<gasche> I believe that marshalling closures relies on the fact that you are only sending it to the same program in return, not a different one, so a notion of code identity exists; toplevel makes code identity a harder problem by dynamically adding new code
<justin_smith> yeah, I just tested it, works in a file generated by ocamlopt
<justin_smith> gasche: that totally makes sense, yes. Thank you.
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<rgrinberg> Bluddy[m]: you've mentioned on the mailing lists that you have some qualms with reddit that it moves a little too fast. I've found the opposite is true with r/ocaml. I'd really love see a little more traffic there, in particular more self posts.
<rgrinberg> r/rust and r/haskell are much more cosy places for example
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<gasche> well
<gasche> r/ocaml is waiting for your parser announce :-)
<rgrinberg> parser announce? do you mean angstrom?
<gasche> the msgpack parser
<rgrinberg> that's hcarty actually :P
<gasche> ah
<gasche> indeed, sorry
<rgrinberg> and i am too waiting for both of those
<gasche> what could you post about ? :-)
<gasche> (I just re-posted the Cordova announce we had on caml-list)
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<rgrinberg> not much at the moment :/ but i'm happy to entertain other posters
<gasche> (one doesn't need to post about one's own stuff, and in fact it's better not to)
<Bluddy[m]> rgrinberg (IRC): My note about reddit was simply to say that one cannot have substantive discussions there. It only takes a few hours for a post to become ancient. It's a good way to keep up with the latest developments though
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<Bluddy[m]> gasche (IRC) (or anyone else): could you explain the concept of GC safe points? I think every function call is a GC safe point, which is why everything must be boxed between functions. But what about allocations inside functions which could call the GC?
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<mrvn> Bluddy[m]: it is
<mrvn> Bluddy[m]: They are expensive because they invalidate any (possible) pointer.
<mrvn> Bluddy[m]: by the way you don't need to tell everyone that they are on irc. We know.
<Bluddy[m]> mrvn: sorry it's just what I get when I autocomplete with tab via vector.im
<mrvn> any call into the GC would need a safe point. But allocations are (hopefully) combined into a single one at the start.
<Bluddy[m]> mrvn: I see.
<mrvn> ocaml is smart enough to see 2 allocations and do a bigger one instead and initialize 2 blocks in the space.
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<def`> gasche: I would like to :)
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<thomasga> why is ocaml-ssl hosted on sourceforge?
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<def`> thomasga: because it is a trusted and friendly host?
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<yomimono> is there a way to know which compilation units are included in a .cma file?
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<yomimono> it looks like ocamlobjinfo can do it, nm
<thomasga> def`: like "The sourceforge.net website is temporarily in static offline mode.
<thomasga> Only a very limited set of project pages are available until the main website returns to service." :-)
<Leonidas> def`: I have heard about the aquisition recently, but SF is everything but "trusted"
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<mrvn> yomimono: have you tried ocamlobjinfo or ocamldumpobj?
<yomimono> mrvn: yep, ocamlobjinfo worked great once we were using consistent objects and objinfo, thanks
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<beginner> Is it possible to tell ocamlbuild to look for ocamlbuild.cmo at a specific path and not where ocamlbuild -where would point to?
<beginner> i tried adding the path with -I, but that didnt workd
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<Bluddy[m]> def` (IRC): were you being sarcastic?
<def`> Bluddy[m]: when?
<Bluddy[m]> when you said sourceforge was reliable and friendly
<def`> ahhh, yes of course :)
<Bluddy[m]> :)
<Bluddy[m]> btw I asked before -- are you adding to implicits' theory, or just proofing the implementation, or both?
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<def`> Bluddy[m]: bits of both, we were working with Jacques Garrigue in Nagoya university and made progress on the theory, and I plan to spend the end of the year on implementation
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<Bluddy[m]> def: any particular difficulties with the theory? Do you have a proof you're happy with?
<def`> Bluddy[m]: principality and characterisation of solution space.
<def`> proof is ok for resolution of constraint, collect of constraints is a longer term work
<def`> afk
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<seliopou> thomasga: i just git the ssl issue you were alluding to
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<Leonidas> I really like how much focus OCaml development puts on shipping features that are working well and founded in solid theory :)
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<seliopou> Hmm... Oasis has issues disabled. That's a bit obnoxious.
<seliopou> Might as well keep my bugs to myself, I suppose.
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<engil> seliopou: I guess he want people to use the ocamlforge thing
<seliopou> There's an ocamlforge page for it?
<engil> looks like it, I don't have an account so I can't check
<seliopou> I suppose I will my pull request privileges to change the README to point there for issues.
<seliopou> Thanks
<engil> haven't been used since 2010 though
<engil> ha nah, bad ordering, my mistake.
<seliopou> the issue i came across (more or less) was reported in 2010: https://forge.ocamlcore.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=832&group_id=54&atid=291
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<seliopou> thomasga thanks!
<seliopou> there should really be a way to associate a cache with each opam repository
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<hcarty> seliopou: I thought opam.ocaml.org did some kind of automatic mirroring of upstream packages... I may be remembering that incorrectly though
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<seliopou> hcarty definitely doesn't. there was actually a controversial patch to opam a while back that hard-coded the URI of a chaching server, and (hopefully) it was rejected
<seliopou> but user-configurable, or default for a repo? +1
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<orbifx> any good writings for how to structure the directories of ocaml projects?
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<companion_cube> I just use src/, possily with one sub-directory per sub-library for complex projects
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<orbifx> ok thanks companion_cube
<orbifx> will start with that
<orbifx> it's what I normally do, but this project might get more serious
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<companion_cube> this scales to dozens of kloc :p
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<hcarty> companion_cube: And, hopefully, if scale beyond that is required ... opam
<mrvn> orbifx: if it gets that big then split out libraries into their own project.
<orbifx> thanks mrvn
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<mrvn> What I find tricky (with oasis / myocamlbuild) is to have a library L in the project with module M and then in the main program L.M.foo should work (and does) but just M.foo should not (but does).
<mrvn> oasis or myocamlbuild always puts the libraries source dir in the include path so both the L pack and the plain M.ml are visible.
<mrvn> any recepies to prevent that?
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<orbifx> I use maikefiles for now :P
<orbifx> Makefiles
<orbifx> But I don't know if that solves your problem
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<orbifx> Any particular readon why the stdlib developers decided to return negative, positive or 0 for the compare functions? Instead of say an enumeration?
<mrvn> no enumeration in stdlib
<companion_cube> it's 20 years old
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<companion_cube> it might be a tiny wee bit faster
<mrvn> standard for compare functions since ever
<companion_cube> and easier to interface with C
<companion_cube> but I agree, a sum type would be better
<mrvn> -1, 0, 1 is good for asm. means the cpu can jump directly for any compare you might need
<mrvn> 0/1/2 would need an extra compare
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<pierpa> it's the traditional way other language did it. When the items compared are scalars, they just do a subtraction. One machine instruction.
<pierpa> *languages
<companion_cube> apparently it 's wrong, because overflows
<companion_cube> but, well
<orbifx> i see mrvn, yeah
<pierpa> companion_cube: these subtleties usually are swept under the rug and accepted
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<companion_cube> s/sutleties/bugs/ ?
<companion_cube> I understand the choice 20 years ago; if it was to remake today I'd personnally opt for the the sum type
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<pierpa> I'm talking about *tradition*
<pierpa> of course a sum type is better
<mrvn> would be cool if you could type cmp = LESS [@@value -1] | EQUAL [@@value 0] | LARGER [@@value 1]
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<companion_cube> heh
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