apeiros changed the topic of #ruby-lang to: RIP Jim || Ruby 2.1.1; 2.0.0-p451; 1.9.3-p545: http://ruby-lang.org || Paste >3 lines of text on http://gist.github.com
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<t4nk470> new to Ruby - old to Java.... Can I easily combine Ruby dev with Java libs?
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<whitequark> t4nk470: take a look at jruby. short answer: yes.
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<t4nk746> I'm trying to install ruby using rbenv, but it is stopped responding, what will be the reason ?
<t4nk746> This is the command i tried to install ruby
<yorickpeterse> morning
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<yorickpeterse> That rule is so arbitrary it hurts my butt
* apeiros prefers [] for %w - they're arrays after all
<yorickpeterse> No you have to use %()
<yorickpeterse> because you have to
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<apeiros> only if you contribute to thoughtbot stuff :)
<apeiros> or use houndci (whatsthat?)
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<yorickpeterse> basically Rubocop as a service
<apeiros> I see
<yorickpeterse> but it needs full Github access so I refuse to use it
<apeiros> :)
<apeiros> yeah, I love how so many services want access waaaay beyond what they need
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<apeiros> "I want to know where you live, so give me all your keys!"
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<yorickpeterse> I wouldn't mind using a Rubocop as a service but I'd rather do it the Travis CI way
<yorickpeterse> That is, give access to specific repos
<yorickpeterse> and properly support private/public organizations and all that
<yorickpeterse> (quick, somebody go to kickstarter for this)
<apeiros> I'd prefer if something like travis was available as docker thingy
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<apeiros> since we simply can't use external services for our code
<yorickpeterse> Jemkins
<yorickpeterse> Seriously, it's a royal pain to set up but it's also quite the beast in terms of what you can do with it
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<apeiros> I tried 3 CI servers ~3y ago
<apeiros> maybe stuff has gotten better, but if not, I'd rather write my own
<apeiros> I mean… how hard can it be
<ohsix> heh the naming conventions are funny, it's like the kde people trying to put k on everything
<apeiros> "run tests, report failure"
<ohsix> it's nontrivial for reproducable stuff
<apeiros> ohsix: kEverything, please.
<ohsix> if you have a lot of targets you build for and support it has multiplicative effects
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<ohsix> for one ... i dunno
<yorickpeterse> apeiros: you'd be surprised
<yorickpeterse> e.g. we use Jenkins for tests, deployments, pre-compiling Gems and all that crap
<yorickpeterse> I'd be damned writing an entire CI for that myself
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<ohsix> heh yea, you don't have to throw out the output, you can leave whole trees or whatever for people to try that checkins version, or you can ask the same system to generate point in time stuff
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<apeiros> yorickpeterse: I might actually write one with the limited scope of testing apps using my framework
<ohsix> you still need to run local tests before you push, unless you have a staging branch you merge from or something after it succeeds
<ohsix> but they can also be the same git hook
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<apeiros> I don't think you *need* to. it certainly would make sense, though. or at least have some workflow where you have branch(es) which are considered "clean" (passed CI)
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<yorickpeterse> apeiros: I don't see the point in re-inventing a square wheel
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<yorickpeterse> Soon you'll get the question "We want Email notifications!" then "We want IRC notifications!" followed by "We want to upload stuff to S3 and RubyGems automatically". Before you know it you've created Continuous Cthulhu
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<apeiros> yorickpeterse: simple answer to all: "fork, patch, PR"
<yorickpeterse> You'll still get a Cthulhu
<apeiros> but it'll be MY cthulhu!
<yorickpeterse> Because one nerd decides to do it in Bash, the other one will use some freak of nature mix of Ruby and Rust
<apeiros> know what? maybe that'll be the name of the CI :)
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<apeiros> yorickpeterse: uh, I can reject PRs, yknow?
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<yorickpeterse> Funny that I say that, since our CI runs on a mix of Jenkins, Bash and Ruby
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<yorickpeterse> I have not seen Cthulhu around yet
<yorickpeterse> also Cthulhu is a pain to type
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<yorickpeterse> Thraedngi question, well a multi-process question in this case. Assume I have a trillion processes that could potentially insert the same data into a table. What would be the best way to prevent this? [...]
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<yorickpeterse> The easiest is to lock the table on inserts but lol no
<yorickpeterse> CAS might work but meh
<yorickpeterse> MySQL has some stuff for it (INSERT UPDATE ON DUPLICATE or w/e it was) but it requires clever constraint hacks
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<yorickpeterse> It's not super critical to prevent duplicates, but it would be nice
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<yorickpeterse> inb4 find_or_create, that's not safe in any way as far as I can tell
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<apeiros> stop the database.
<apeiros> nothing can insert anymore :o)
<apeiros> why is it a problem? a database is usually supposed to be used from multiple clients at the same time and should not have any issues with it.
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<apeiros> aha, you want to avoid duplicates
<yorickpeterse> Yeah
<apeiros> should have said so :-p
<yorickpeterse> It's unlikely to happen
<yorickpeterse> I did
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<yorickpeterse> Either way, it's unlikely but I prefer to go for the "It's simply not possible for duplicate data to occur" case
<apeiros> there are create or update patterns in sql standard. but I think it's something which has lots of db specific solutions
<apeiros> so what db?
<apeiros> unique constraints and rescue errors
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<yorickpeterse> MySQL
<apeiros> ah yeah, mysql with myisam is horrible wrt writes…
<yorickpeterse> We don't use MyISAM
<apeiros> innodb?
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<yorickpeterse> yup
<yorickpeterse> got transactions yo
<yorickpeterse> welcome to 2005
<yorickpeterse> grrr myisam
<yorickpeterse> Either way, a transaction *might* help but I'm not sure if it would prevent race conditions
<apeiros> I think I'd try unique constraints and rescue the error
<apeiros> the db should handle that correctly
<apeiros> (then again, it's mysql…)
<yorickpeterse> well yeah, you can turn off warnings (lol)
<yorickpeterse> surely if there's no warning everything is fine
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<apeiros> hey, at least it has warnings
<apeiros> I've worked with dbs which on 1mio record imports would silently drop a couple of thousands
<yorickpeterse> But yeah, I might just have to rescue record exists errors
<apeiros> because… something was wrong. well, lets just ignore those. you surely don't want them in the db.
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<ljarvis> hi
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<apeiros> hi ljarvis
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<yorickpeterse> Turn it into a Ruby meetup
<yorickpeterse> "London.rb - Also ljarvis's wedding"
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<judofyr> ljarvis: getting married in a year? nice!
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<judofyr> anyone have a name for a TODO-list project I'm going to start and never finish?
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: didn't zzak_ combine ko1's wedding with some Ruby meetups?
<yorickpeterse> I have no idea
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: "TODO"
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<ndrst> judofyr: call it never. thats what most todos are there for
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<judofyr> "Nope"
<judofyr> that could work
<yorickpeterse> "not-today"
<yorickpeterse> $ not-today "Take a bath"
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<ljarvis> everything that needs to be done always gets moved to 'tomorrow', "I'll do it tomorrow", $ tomorrow "Call mom"
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<apeiros_> heh, I like the idea of a todo app called 'tomorro'
<apeiros_> *tomorrow
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<yorickpeterse> We have this thing here where basically everything should be done by yesterday
<yorickpeterse> it's a running gag even
<sluukkonen> apeiros_: actually Mañana
<ljarvis> I think yesterday and tomorrow and both good
<ljarvis> the latter is way easier to type
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<judofyr> yorickpeterse: would you recommend depending on your XML parser? is it still changing a lot?
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<yorickpeterse> judofyr: are you crazy?
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<yorickpeterse> judofyr: it's not even on RubyGems yet
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: guess I'll have to stick to Nokogiri then :(
<yorickpeterse> it's not even remotely done
<yorickpeterse> give or take 2 months, then I expect an alpha
<yorickpeterse> depending on how much shit JRuby will give me
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<yorickpeterse> The lexer and parsers are in place, but there's no CSS/Xpath support yet
<yorickpeterse> JRuby doesn't work yet either
<yorickpeterse> (at least not the native ext version)
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<momomomomo> yorickpeterse: mind if I ask: why?
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<yorickpeterse> because I haven't set up a working Java ext yet
<yorickpeterse> Documentation is far and between, most of what I found is from 2010 and only mentions half of what's needed
<yorickpeterse> I have the basic bits but actually loading the JRuby ext takes some extra effort that doesn't seem to be needed
<yorickpeterse> e.g. Nokogiri somehow loads the Java stuff just fine
<yorickpeterse> also have to port of the lexer to Java
<yorickpeterse> Then port it over to a templating setup so that I don't have to re-define the same grammar twice
<yorickpeterse> Hopefully JRuby should be running later this week
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<sluukkonen> is nokogiri really that bad?
<judofyr> always a hassle to install
<judofyr> that's my main issue
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<yorickpeterse> also make no mistake, libxml is not thread-safe
<ljarvis> :D
<sluukkonen> I'm guessing that's mainly a problem for rubinius
<sluukkonen> anyhow, the java port has worked fine for my needs
<sluukkonen> not a hassle to install either
<yorickpeterse> The C-ext version can easily take ~10 minutes to install on EC2
<yorickpeterse> vendoring libxml on itself is already bonkers
<yorickpeterse> I believe that Nokogiri is actually the single biggest Gem I have installed next to a bunch of internal Gems
<ljarvis> there's an ongoing internal discussion regarding the size
<sluukkonen> hmm, it vendors libxml these days?
<ljarvis> but yeah, I agree that's one problem amongst many
<sluukkonen> libxml2 even
<sluukkonen> I remember always installing it from my package manager before installing nokogiri
<yorickpeterse> You can disable libxml2 compilation using NOKOGIRI_USE_SOMETHING_I_FORGOT
<yorickpeterse> But then you get problems where Noko doesn't work properly with some libxml2 versions
<yorickpeterse> it's quite the mess
<ljarvis> NOKOGIRI_USE_SYSTEM_LIBRARIES
<sluukkonen> that must be fairly recent
<sluukkonen> like couple of years old at most ;)
<yorickpeterse> Personal problem is that it also seems to be pretty difficult to get a hang of tenderlove at times, though I can't really blame him for that
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<sluukkonen> ok, apparently that appeared in 1.6 so june 2013
<yorickpeterse> e.g. report a bug, ask for a release. No reply for a month, then it turns out it was there 2 weeks already
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<sluukkonen> anyhow, thanks for the insight
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<yorickpeterse> None of those are problems on their own that are worth the effort of writing an alternative
<yorickpeterse> But combined they piss me off more than MongoDB
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<deg-> how to you specify that you have to have a minimum version of ruby? For example, >= 2.0? in Bundler i can ruby 'specific version' but it doesn't seem to work with >=
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<reichni> How can I define an array of Structs inside my Struct "Message"? Because every message has many "Signals" and each of this signal have a name and a value. http://pastie.org/9146200
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<canton7> reichni, you, uh, make an array of structs. what exactly are you having a problem with? can you pastie what you've tried?
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<johnny5> yo yo yo epitron
<johnny5> sup
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<crankharder> I should know this... is the old hashrocket syntax planned on being deprecated in some future version?
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<yfeldblum> crankharder: is there syntax for array-keyed hashes besides hashrocket syntax?
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<crankharder> so that's a no?
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<foucist> how do you folks decide whether to extend existing functionality in your app or use a gem... there a good rule of thumb?
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<foucist> in my case i have existing functionality that partially implements what the gem would bring..
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<wallerdev> foucist: if the gem seems well supported and does what you want id probably just delete the stuff i wrote and use the gem instead
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<apeiros> foucist: I use the "fuck this" threshold
<foucist> apeiros: describe :P
<foucist> "fuck this, gonna use a gem instead" ?
<foucist> "fuck this gem, gonna code it myself" ? :P
<apeiros> write code, write, write, maintain, maintain, update, fix, "fuck this!" - use gem.
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<apeiros> same thing in reverse for dropping a gem
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<johnny5> ;)
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<johnny5> Authenticator: did u figure that out yet
<johnny5> the authenicating business
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<johnny5> something like a username and pw combo right idk?
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<johnny5> ayo Anusko