mnemoc changed the topic of #arm-netbook to: EOMA: Embedded Open Modular Architecture - Don't ask to ask. Just ask! - http://elinux.org/Embedded_Open_Modular_Architecture/EOMA-68 - ML arm-netbook@lists.phcomp.co.uk - Logs http://ibot.rikers.org/%23arm-netbook or http://irclog.whitequark.org/arm-netbook/ - http://rhombus-tech.net/
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<CIA-16> rhombus-tech: William master * rd211f89aa490 /allwinner_a10/orders/cheslot98.mdwn:
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<Byan> so any news over here?
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<TomNL> gimli: any news from allwinner?
<gimli> TomNL: yes, but no comment aoubt it. i go back to my old developemnt model. when things are ready i talk about it.
<TomNL> ok :) i think thats a good idea, i am glad you guys are talking again! Good luck!
<lundman> unless this 10yen will change yourmind
* lundman slides 10yen to gimli
<gimli> lol
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<Marex> sigh ... why is the CM9 for MK802 so slow ? Is it leaking memory somewhere or something ?
<Marex> or is it just a general lack of RAM so the device is indeed insufficient ?
<jelly-home> Marex: you have a 512 or a 1GB version?
<Marex> 512MB one
<jelly-home> might just be it, there's probably a reason why andoid 4.x smartphones have a full GB
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<popolon> there are even 2GB ones
<popolon> http://www.xiaomi.com/mi2 <= this ~220€ phone :)
<popolon> 250€ at the today change rate
<Marex> jelly-home: hm ... time to rape the SD card than, with swap on it ...
<jelly-home> swap over network! what could go wrong
<Marex> jelly-home: that's landing in 3.6 ;-)
<Marex> swap over NFS :p
<Marex> or was it 3.5? 3.7? something like that
<jelly-home> 3.5-ish
<jelly-home> I mean, it existed before, you could do swap over nbd
<jelly-home> however, tricky for the kernel to leave enough ram not to choke on its own gut
<rm> it works
<rm> and worked long before 3.5
<rm> swap over aoe, nbd, even into a regular file on NFS, mounted as a loop device
<rm> probably there are deadlocks e.g. when you run really low on RAM
<rm> but for light use, it just worked for me
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<jelly-home> probably faster to swap to your desktop's RAM or disk over network than to kill the SD card with lots of small writes
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<popolon> Does someone still use Android on one of his arm devices here ?
<RaYmAn> only my tablets & phones
<popolon> cool
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<popolon> I would like to know how runs blender on arm tablet using android ?
<RaYmAn> There's a blender android port?
<popolon> you can find the august 19 beta port following this link
<rm> crazy
<RaYmAn> that's cool
<popolon> my android device usb port is broken :/
<RaYmAn> it seems to be for games though
<popolon> no
<popolon> there is player for gamess
<popolon> and modeler now
<RaYmAn> the site just only mentions the player
<popolon> there was a screenshot of the application in last dev newsletter
<popolon> this is the modeler
<popolon> this is the player
<popolon> still not finished
<popolon> but already works
<popolon> there is a linux/arm port too
<popolon> (on *buntu distro at least
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<RaYmAn> I suppose it is mostly python so makes sense :)
<popolon> and arm ask an official khronos OpenCL 1.1 certificate for mali 600 :)
<popolon> no, blender is mostly in c
<popolon> but lot of python code too
<RaYmAn> it'll be interesting to see what thei rinterface is like
<popolon> like this :)
<popolon> should be better with tablet
<RaYmAn> a screenshot doesn't tell much :)
<popolon> => that's the same interface
<popolon> you can test the apk if you want...
<RaYmAn> surely they must have done something to make it usable without keyboard
<RaYmAn> yeah, I will =P
<popolon> mostly usable by mouse
<popolon> so no problem with a not too big finger or a capacitive stylus or resistive tablet with stylus
<popolon> <= search for another mean to install the apk on its galaxy s :)
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<popolon> an xserver for android ?
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<RaYmAn> popolon: it's really not (the 08_19_12.apk) - it's just the player
<RaYmAn> wrong url?
<popolon> :(
<popolon> wrong reading then
<popolon> still to wait
<popolon> sorry
<popolon> The developer still work on it, it could be out at the same time than 2.64 final, in september ?
<popolon> else can probably already be compiled from sources
<popolon> That's linked to Google Summer of Code : Alex Kuznetsov has Blender’s UI running in Android (Using Jason Wilkin’s work on opengl abstraction layers):
<popolon> that's strange that the file is named blender and not blenderplayer
<popolon> and has the same date that this news
<popolon> s/that/than/
<ibot> popolon meant: and has the same date than this news
<popolon> RaYmAn, are you sure ? The BlenderPlayer apk is 16 Mo sized and the blender.apk is 30Mo sized ?
<RaYmAn> popolon: I downloaded and installed http://download.blender.org/ftp/incoming/Blender_08_19_12.apk on my tablet
<popolon> ok
<popolon> strange to see a grow of twice the size in two weeks :)
<popolon> the actual x86 64bit version is about ~50 MB (not "Mo", sorry, french) bz2 compressed
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<BoozeWooz> helps??
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: you have to ask your question. I don't know the answer, but these guys work with ARM and booting.
<Marex> popolon: Mo ?
<BoozeWooz> o ok , i thought they would receive the question from the other IRC channel too :P
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz is asking if there's a boot process to start from SD, but continue loading from USB
<Marex> popolon: how do you say megabyte in french ?
<ManoftheSea> on an ARM device
<BoozeWooz> Odroid-X to be exact :o
<BoozeWooz> so it has exynos 4412 if thats relevant
<RaYmAn> depends on what you mean by continue loading. If the device can load kernel from SD and e.g. rootfs off USB, that's fairly easy on most boards.
<BoozeWooz> hmm well yeah i was thinking of placing /boot on SD-card and rest on USB but that doesnt work
<BoozeWooz> i wrote image to SD-card, and it has these weird boot partitions at hte start :s
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: these guys will tell you, there's no standard boot process in ARM.
<ManoftheSea> if that image is for the internal memory, it won't work from the SD
<BoozeWooz> hmm
<BoozeWooz> well.. there is a pre-made image. except its like 8gb, and comes with lots of useless crap pre-installed
<BoozeWooz> so i guess i could botch it up a little, making it work properly
<BoozeWooz> on the pc i currently use theres /boot/grub/grub.cfg
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: sure, but on the PC, the firmware looks for the MBR
<ManoftheSea> There's no MBR in ARM
<BoozeWooz> and in there i can just do --set root (the media) and .. /boot/stuff
<RaYmAn> if you can get a kernel starting up from sd, just passing a suitable root= argument (possibly + rootwait) to point at USB
<ManoftheSea> Which is why these guys are trying to do an FSF-endorsable ARM system, with a standard.
<BoozeWooz> but theres nothing in there to set the path sadly..
<BoozeWooz> what directory would it be?
<RaYmAn> it depends on how the bootloader and board is setup
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: do you know your bootloader on that device?
<BoozeWooz> i think it was u-boot? but im not sure, how to check?
<ManoftheSea> it's an android, right?
<BoozeWooz> currently theres linaro on it
<RaYmAn> it's running u-boot - at least that's the sources hardkernel gives out
<ManoftheSea> Is the cmdline compiled in to the kernel?
<RaYmAn> it's more likely it's in the u-boot script/env
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<BoozeWooz> uhh im not sure.. i can run terminal if thats what youre asking
<BoozeWooz> but i can ctrl+alt+f1 to another desktop
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: do you have the kernel sources?
<popolon> Marex, Megaoctet (octet=8 (bits), so a byte)
<ManoftheSea> If you run make menuconfig, you can look in the kernel setup for a cmdline
<ManoftheSea> If it's not there, we can assume it's in the u-boot
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<BoozeWooz> let me try to find it
<BoozeWooz> yes they are here
<RaYmAn> usually kenrels are setup to use bootloader passed cmdline if it's there and otherwise use the hardcoded one
<ManoftheSea> RaYmAn: so if we rule one out...
<RaYmAn> ManoftheSea: yeah, but that only works if it's empty : )Otherwise it says nothing
<RaYmAn> i guess you could check if /proc/cmdline on the running device matches the kernel config specified one
<ManoftheSea> oh yeah, procfs
<BoozeWooz> i will check that, hold on
<BoozeWooz> ughhh... my plug came out broken.. i need to solder it back on. moment please
<hno> hi RaYmAn. I integrated the DRAM changes in test1. Yet to find a moment to test it proper.
<RaYmAn> hno: cool - pushed it? I'll uhm, try and see if I can test it later
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<hno> RaYmAn, yes it's pushed.
<hno> Looking into boot1 now as the clock initialization in boot0 seems to be only half-way.
<RaYmAn> I guess it only initializes the absolute minimum
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<GreenHide> hi folks
<GreenHide> anyone know where to buy a "Mele A1000" unit in europe?
<rm> just buy from China and have it shipped to you
<GreenHide> rm, I dont want to pay a s*it load of taxes!!
<GreenHide> well thanks anyway
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<BoozeWooz> hello
<ManoftheSea> hi again, BoozeWooz
<ManoftheSea> did you get anywhere?
<BoozeWooz> hey
<BoozeWooz> yeah, i was thinking of loading busybox from SD-card
<BoozeWooz> and from busybox i can load everything i want?
<BoozeWooz> how does that sound?
<ManoftheSea> good luck
<BoozeWooz> is it difficult :o ?
<BoozeWooz> you dont sound too convinced..
<ManoftheSea> I believe you'll have trouble getting busybox loaded
<ManoftheSea> Because of your boot sequence.
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<ManoftheSea> But once you've done that, smooth sailing
<BoozeWooz> well problem with busybox is that there is no armv7 binary
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<BoozeWooz> here is the link for all busyboxes
<ManoftheSea> sounds like you'll have to compile yourself.
<BoozeWooz> uh oh.. never done that before
<ManoftheSea> you're probably in over your head.
<ManoftheSea> Download the source package, set your environment to use a cross-compiler, make
<ManoftheSea> or, make config first, busybox is complex
<BoozeWooz> well.. i know some C and made some programs with it but never compiled any linux kernel
<BoozeWooz> config?
<BoozeWooz> ooh yes make config : D
<ManoftheSea> did you figure out how to set the cmdline?
<BoozeWooz> the cmdline?
<ManoftheSea> yeah, the linux cmdline
<BoozeWooz> ive been doing 1001 things i think i forgot
<BoozeWooz> you want me to look if i can go into cmd?
<ManoftheSea> no. Did you check the kernel source for the cmdline?
<ManoftheSea> And the /proc/cmdline, if it matches on your device?
<BoozeWooz> not yet
<ManoftheSea> If they match, you can set the cmdline by compiling it in
<BoozeWooz> booting it now
<ManoftheSea> If not, you'll need to edit u-boot (somehow) to pass a different cmdline
<ManoftheSea> then, you'll need to either pass init=/bin/busybox, or you'll need to move busybox to /bin/init
<BoozeWooz> well theres a short guide on installing your own things
<ManoftheSea> busybox apps?
<ManoftheSea> yes, but you need to cross-compile.
<ManoftheSea> Do you know how to do that?
<BoozeWooz> hmm in code blocks i have some compilers installed
<BoozeWooz> im currently just compiling it on x86
<ManoftheSea> I don't even know which compiler you'd need.
<BoozeWooz> but make config stops at the following: " Character code to substitute unprintable characters with (SUBST_WCHAR) [63] (NEW)
<BoozeWooz> "
<ManoftheSea> but you'll need to compile for arm
<BoozeWooz> its no problem i think, i can put the source code on the ARM device and make from there
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: try make menuconfig
<ManoftheSea> sure, that'd work
<BoozeWooz> hmmm but what do i do with the Character code to subsitute... ?
<ManoftheSea> dunno
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<BoozeWooz> /proc/cmdline says:
<BoozeWooz> root=/dev/mmcblk0p3 rw rootfstype=ext4 init=/sbin/init console =ttySAC1,115200
<BoozeWooz> its compiling
<BoozeWooz> done
<ManoftheSea> and the kernel sources? Do they say the same thing?
<BoozeWooz> do you mean the kernel source codes?
<ManoftheSea> if so, there's a good chance you could compile with root=/dev/sdXY to boot from USB
<BoozeWooz> hmm well theres no /proc/cmd there so i guess there must be a binary that holds the content
<BoozeWooz> so cant i just hex edit that binary?
<BoozeWooz> hmm not bad actually, sec ill try
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: no...
<ManoftheSea> what? /proc/cmd? Where did that come from?
<BoozeWooz> no? :D
<BoozeWooz> i mean proc/cmdline
<ManoftheSea> that's just informative, after the system has booted.
<BoozeWooz> but it mst get its content from somewhere right?
<ManoftheSea> In your kernel sources, run make menuconfig
<ManoftheSea> search for cmdline
<BoozeWooz> (in the compiled kernel)
<ManoftheSea> I believe it's in the .config somewhere.
<BoozeWooz> lets try to find this :D
<BoozeWooz> geany is running a search "find in files" so ill be back in some hours :o
<ManoftheSea> uh, wut?
<BoozeWooz> thanks for your help, much appreciated :D
<ManoftheSea> it's under "processor type and features"->"Built in command line
<BoozeWooz> but then ill have to rebuild the entire kernel
<BoozeWooz> i want just to have this hex edited and it wont be a problem
<BoozeWooz> what file would it compile to?
<BoozeWooz> vmlinuz?
<BoozeWooz> currently downloading the kernel source codes, its fairly big
<ManoftheSea> um, might be.
<ManoftheSea> Could also be xipImage
<BoozeWooz> wht
<BoozeWooz> its in config-35.02- etc
<BoozeWooz> CONFIG_CMDLINE="root=/dev/mmcblk0p1 rw rootwait console=ttySAC2,115200"
<BoozeWooz> o___O
<BoozeWooz> /boot/config-3.5.0-2-linaro-lt-origen
<BoozeWooz> so i just set this to some sda1-9 and happy times?
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<ManoftheSea> sorry, what?
<BoozeWooz> :D welcome back
<ManoftheSea> thanks.
<BoozeWooz> i found it in /boot/config-3.5.0-2-linaro-lt-origen
<BoozeWooz> CONFIG_CMDLINE="root=/dev/mmcblk0p1 rw rootwait console=ttySAC2,115200"
<BoozeWooz> this any good ;O ?
<BoozeWooz> ^^
<ManoftheSea> does that match the running system /proc/cmdline
<BoozeWooz> yes
<ManoftheSea> then I think you can expect a kernel with cmdline="root=/dev/sdXY ..." will allow you to boot from USB
<BoozeWooz> well in proc/cmdline theres also init=/sbin/init and rootdelay=2
<hno> BoozeWooz, is CONFIG_CMDLINE_FORCE set in your kernel .config?
<hno> if not then it's using the command line set by the bootloader (usually u-boot)
<BoozeWooz> # CONFIG_CMDLINE_FORCE is not set
<RaYmAn> BoozeWooz: you're probably better off looking at u-boot
<BoozeWooz> its a bad thnig :S ?
<BoozeWooz> bah.... ><
<ManoftheSea> it makes it harder
<RaYmAn> no, it's a good thing
<hno> It's a good thing the kernel do not forces command line.
<BoozeWooz> i think u-boot got its own partition.. and i cannot seem to open it..
<ManoftheSea> well, more convenient
<BoozeWooz> what if i made it to force?
<RaYmAn> then it would ignore u-boot's cmdline.
<hno> You could, but you likely need console access anyway so focus on that first.
<BoozeWooz> :DD which is what i want exactly
<RaYmAn> but it's really quite silly. You're much better off setting u-boot's cmdline like you want it :P
<RaYmAn> Did you get the serial board with it?
<BoozeWooz> hmm it was like 5 extra usd so i passed
<BoozeWooz> was like a dinky uart thing
<hno> BoozeWooz, congratulations, saving5 USD just cost you countless number of hours pulling hairs.
<ManoftheSea> RaYmAn: do you know how to edit u-boot?
<ManoftheSea> is that JTAG?
<BoozeWooz> uhh what... but you said i cn just put it on force?
<ManoftheSea> er, via JTAG?
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: there's the right way and the easy way.
<RaYmAn> ManoftheSea: on that particular device? Not really - I don't have one. But I doubt it's particularly hard to do.
<ManoftheSea> The easy way might work, but you'll have a lot of debugging if it doesn't
<ManoftheSea> Being able to edit u-boot means you can change root= at will
<ManoftheSea> as well as boot from other devices, etc.
<BoozeWooz> welll.. only problem i see now is how to know what name the USB is
<hno> ManoftheSea, u-boot settings is preferably done using serial console.
<BoozeWooz> idk if it depends on what port its connected to?
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: use UUID
<BoozeWooz> hmm interesting, yes that would do the trick
<hno> UUID rewquires an initrd to look for the device.
<BoozeWooz> 2ndly, i can just binary edit it with a hx editor
<hno> kernel do not hunt UUID devices
<BoozeWooz> IF i could open that partition, which i cant
<hno> life is so much easier if you have the proiper access channels open (i.e serial console)
<BoozeWooz> hmm if i attach an usb in linux, now its sdb2
<ManoftheSea> I assumed an initrd.
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: is that a good or bad assumption?
<BoozeWooz> can i just use it as root=/ sdb2? or might it change?
<BoozeWooz> uhh im not sure, i dont know much about linux tbh
<ManoftheSea> it might change, depending on other usb devices plugged or unplugged.
<BoozeWooz> thats bad
<ManoftheSea> You're trying to do something very advanced, for not having much linux knowledge.
<BoozeWooz> :( i just want to boot from usb2
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<BoozeWooz> then i can put a debian, and have my own software installed
<BoozeWooz> right now its unusable with this "unity" trash on it
<ManoftheSea> unity isn't a distro
<ManoftheSea> is it?
<BoozeWooz> the desktop environoment
<BoozeWooz> its linaro, based on ubuntu
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: you could just install gnome-shell, or xfce
<ManoftheSea> You don't need to switch distro for that.
<BoozeWooz> i want lxde
<BoozeWooz> preferrably with ubuntu software center
<ManoftheSea> so... apt-get install lxde
<BoozeWooz> not from sd :o need usb2 to harddisk
<BoozeWooz> pity theres no sata
<ManoftheSea> why not from sd?
<ManoftheSea> If it can hold unity and gnome3, you should be able to fit lxde
<ManoftheSea> You might have to remove unity first, though.
<BoozeWooz> its painfully slow, i mean like
<BoozeWooz> takes ages to load something and very unresponsive
<ManoftheSea> you could chroot into the usb, and run from there.
<ManoftheSea> That wouldn't involve reflashing your kernel or messing with uboot
<BoozeWooz> chroot?
<BoozeWooz> i just putted it on CMDLINE force, and changed it to sdb1 but it didnt do anything ..
<ManoftheSea> you're not familiar with chroot?
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<BoozeWooz> not really :o ?
<BoozeWooz> please explain
<ManoftheSea> BoozeWooz: you need to look it up on google, or man pages
<BoozeWooz> i will, thanks
<BoozeWooz> but i will first try this cmdline thing, if that works then u-boot (proper way)
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<ManoftheSea> good luck
<BoozeWooz> thanks... i have a feeling i will need it
<BoozeWooz> oh and busybox is always an option too
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<popolon> forgot who ask me about in corporate sport in china
<BoozeWooz> huh
<popolon> because I spoke about this picture :)
<popolon> and can't find it again (in my thouthands of tabs :))
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<Marex> popolon: no gurlz :p
<popolon> huhu
<furan> girls just slow us down
<ManoftheSea> don't be sexist
<furan> the sex which you are attracted to can slow you down
<furan> how's that, mr politically correct
<furan> it's not sexist, it's just the facts of life
<furan> whenever I'm not in a relationship I get distracted by girls :)
<Marex> furan: well ... girls do have their place :p
<Marex> (I hope it was politically correct ;-) )
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<ManoftheSea> Marex: that sounds even worse. But don't clean up just for me.
<Marex> ManoftheSea: how does it sound even worse ?
<Marex> ManoftheSea: it's the same for dudes, they also do have their place
<furan> I am not against the sex you are attracted to at all
<furan> e.g. I am attracted to girls, I like girls
<furan> just saying it can be distracting!
<ManoftheSea> Since PC-ness is in the eye of the perceiver, I can't speak authoritatively here.
<Marex> furan: now that's the worst, you make me sound like I was gay
<ManoftheSea> But saying "women have their place" sounds like "we tell women their place"
<Marex> ManoftheSea: nay ... that's not the point
<ManoftheSea> and saying "no gurlz" sounds like sexism.
<Marex> ManoftheSea: that was definitelly intended sexism :)
<Marex> ManoftheSea: I'm a man, I like girls ... and there were no girls in the picture, only guys ... :-(
<Marex> ManoftheSea: so ... it was not balance, the picture was sexistic!
<Marex> *balanced
<ManoftheSea> oh, there was a picture?
<popolon> well there are too few mix basketball teams
<popolon> but mens are often taller than girls
<popolon> well, there are lot of tall girls too (depending of my height at least)
<Marex> popolon: well yea, but I usually prefer girls to be less tall than me
<popolon> perhaps tallest girls in china aren't interested in ARM SoC dev
<popolon> I personally like both :)
<popolon> probably if I play basketball, I want to win and girls was in opposite team, I prefer they are smaller
<popolon> But I don't want to play basketball and if I play I probably want they win to make them happy as I don't care about the balloon
<popolon> :)
<Marex> popolon: :D
<Marex> popolon: that was sexistic!
<popolon> sorry
<Marex> popolon: hehe, I don't give a splat :D
<popolon> I really don't want
<Marex> I really don't care ;-)
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<furan> is it true that the non-otg usb ports on the a10 do not support hubs?
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<popolon> bizarre de mettre un - entre un prénom et un nom ???
<popolon> Impressionnant le voir les tours du XIXe derriere sur la photo d'illustration de cet article :)
<popolon> on se rend rarement compte dans paris, la focale devait être super longue :
<popolon> y'a pas les champs exif, dommage
<popolon> c'est pas le 19e dans cette direction, je suis con
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<popolon> c'est le XIIIe :D
<popolon> la tour st jacques en travaux en rajoute une couche
<popolon> a ca doit etre depuis montmartre ou un toit vers les galeries lafayette
<popolon> tiens si j'arrêtais de monologuer ?
<ManoftheSea> popolon: you're speaking fancy
<popolon> oops
<popolon> weonc channel
<popolon> sorry
<popolon> wrong channel
<popolon> I asked myself why I made a monolog on a so pulated channel where people are really active :)) really sorry
<orly_owl> sacre blu!
<ManoftheSea> I wondered why you were talking about art.
<popolon> :)
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