marcan changed the topic of #asahi to: Asahi Linux: porting Linux to Apple Silicon macs | General project discussion | GitHub: https://alx.sh/g | Wiki: https://alx.sh/w | Topics: #asahi-dev #asahi-re #asahi-gpu #asahi-offtopic | Keep things on topic | Logs: https://alx.sh/l/asahi
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<marcan>
< davidrysk[m]> I've been "up 4 days, 20:22" and kernel_task has written 15.68 TB in that time <- uhh
<marcan>
this sounds like a problem in the making
<marcan>
15TB in 2 days is ridiculous
<marcan>
*4 days
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<davidrysk[m]>
marcan: yeah, this is not good
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<TheJollyRoger>
o.O
<TheJollyRoger>
Your poor SSDs and RAIDs and HDDs!
<davidrysk[m]>
at 16.62TB now
<davidrysk[m]>
that was almost a whole TBW in what, 8-9 hours
<davidrysk[m]>
can someone on macOS with security disabled try `sudo zprint -t`?
<marcan>
davidrysk[m]: fwiw, my MBP is at 500GB total writes. it's not like I'm doing too much with but... that sounds about reasonable, given the osx upgrades/reinstalls it's gone through
<marcan>
*with it
<davidrysk[m]>
marcan: you're not running it on macOS though, for daily use, correct?
<marcan>
I am
<davidrysk[m]>
do you typically have a lot of stuff open?
<marcan>
well, for some definition of daily
<marcan>
nope
<davidrysk[m]>
yeah that might be why
<davidrysk[m]>
I have several electron-powered apps open
<davidrysk[m]>
"freezer" is what apple uses on iOS -- it saves the program's state and stops it
<davidrysk[m]>
that's not exactly practical on macOS
<marcan>
so I'm up 2 days with just 2GB written by kernel_task
<marcan>
though this was because my battery died a couple days ago (didn't plug it in all the way...)
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<marcan>
swap used 37MB... yeah I guess my usage pattern doesn't get it to swap
<marcan>
16GB here
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<davidrysk[m]>
marcan: try adding slack, teams, signal, imessages, two or three browsers
<davidrysk[m]>
apparently xnu will panic if you turn off swap entirely and there's memory pressure
<tpw_rules>
my system usually uses around 8GB swap
<davidrysk[m]>
lol disk utility says "S.M.A.R.T. status : Not Supported"
<davidrysk[m]>
that said, activity monitor shows writes consistent with this smart log
<tpw_rules>
my system which seems to have entirely reasonable total writes
<davidrysk[m]>
tpw_rules: M1 or Intel?
<tpw_rules>
intel
<davidrysk[m]>
people are reporting that this doesn't really happen on Intel
<davidrysk[m]>
only on M1
<tpw_rules>
oh okay, good to know
<davidrysk[m]>
I wonder how much of this is due to running Textual IRC
<davidrysk[m]>
but I quit it and the kernel_task usage did not seem to stop
<tpw_rules>
i've ran it for years
<marcan>
davidrysk[m]: holy shit the one you tweeted
<marcan>
different machine?
<davidrysk[m]>
same machine
<davidrysk[m]>
(I only have one M1 machine)
<davidrysk[m]>
marcan: the 1TB was over 8 hours according to activity monitory
<davidrysk[m]>
-y
<marcan>
oh right, sorry, misread
<marcan>
this is way worse than I thought
<marcan>
especially that being a 2T machine
<davidrysk[m]>
yes
<davidrysk[m]>
I've used it heavily, but not that heavily.
<davidrysk[m]>
the memory pressure is always in the green...
<davidrysk[m]>
I can't seem to figure out a way to make activity monitor show real time pageins/pageouts
<davidrysk[m]>
which task manager on windows can do
<davidrysk[m]>
does `sudo zprint` work for anyone?
<davidrysk[m]>
I get "zprint: mach_memory_info: (os/kern) invalid host (try running as root)" but I do have security on
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<marcan>
same here
<marcan>
but I think security should be on for this install too
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<Glanzmann>
I have no memory pressure because I have 16 GB of RAM and only run iterm and firefox and iina (movie player). But I did not figure out which command I have to run to find out how much data has written on macos.
<Glanzmann>
Data Units Written: 1,453,547 [744 GB] - I have it for two months.
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<arnd>
I had tried running a 12GB Linux guest on the 16GB mac mini, which ended up completely unusable. Giving it 8GB was fine mostly. I have about 1TBW after 19 hours of total machine usage (both according to smartctl)
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<tarzeau>
arnd: is that with or without x/gui? wayland? i'm very happy using zram and nohang
<arnd>
tarzeau: this was with MacOS running with one user logged in graphically and another user running a text-only Linux guest through ssh most of the time
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<jix>
do power on hours count something else than the name implies, or is my samsung SSD (non-apple machine) just making up numbers? (wanted to compare my usage to what people report from apple hw)
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<Glanzmann>
arnd: Wow. So you say, while you had the VM running with 12 GB RAM it wrote 1 TBW? Okay of course the OS installation and updates also consume some, but that is strange.
<arnd>
there was also a lot of building all of compiling enough homebrew to run a patched qemu, and whatever the other user did
<arnd>
but it was clearly thrashing while I tried to work inside of the 12GB machine, without anything interesting going on outside
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<cdesai>
2TB writes in total here, 1TB air I got in december, has been pretty much on all the time since then although used sparingly.
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<ch>
15TB, arrived mid-december, been using it pretty much all the time since
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<marcan>
Linux bring-up patchset v2 going out now :)
<maximus64>
is this the final one or there is plan for v3? heh
<imobilis>
great! :)
<hypergenesis[m]>
I suppose it depends on what further feedback is provided on the mailing list
* tarzeau
used to have .signature with Windoze not found: (C)heer, (P)arty or (D)ance?, but now what's the equivalent for macOS ?
<marcan>
maximus64: I would be very surprised if there isn't a v3
<marcan>
but I'm hoping whatever's left to change will be minor :)
<arnd>
there are probably a few very minor comments that can just be addressed in without a resend
<arnd>
the main thing now is to get Acks from the arm64, irqchip, dt and serial maintainers so I can merge it through the soc tree
<marcan>
how often does a new SoC get merged in just a v2? :)
<arnd>
rarely, most new maintainers are less thorough in their initial bringup
<arnd>
then again, we sometimes see new SoC support from maintainers that already own multiple other platforms, and those might go in after v1. Same for anything that is just a minor revision of an existing SoC family
<arnd>
we rarely have one that requires changes to core code like this one does
<arnd>
marcan: you will probably get a semi-automated message from gregkh, telling you that he doesn't review serial driver patches during the merge window
<kettenis>
stdout-path = "serial0:1500000";
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<kettenis>
is that intentional, or is that just a placeholder that gets filled in by m1n1 with the real baudrate?
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<_jannau_>
kettenis: it is the real baudrate when using m1n1 via proxyclient
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<marcan>
arnd: I didn't CC greg, I figured Krzysztof would take care of the samsung stuff and there are no longer any changes outside of that
<marcan>
kettenis: I've been standardizing on 1.5mbaud here for loading kernels and because why not (it's the fastest it goes)
<marcan>
m1n1 boots at 115200 but the first thing all the client stuff does is switch to 1.5m
<arnd>
marcan: gregkh will have to provide an Ack for merging the changes through the soc tree instead of the serial tree
<arnd>
krzk of course should review whether the changes are ok before that
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<marcan>
ah, right
<marcan>
arnd: is there a good way to map out who needs to be CCed from get_maintainers output? or just everyone? (that's a lot of people)
<marcan>
e.g. the simplefb change is only a change to the binding (documenting already supported modes and adding a compatible), but sending the entire series to everyone involved in fb/drm seems excessive for that? I don't really know how this usually goes
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<marcan>
(sorry for the newbie questions)
<modwizcode>
How many people is it?
<arnd>
marcan: there is no good automated way. Best apply some common sense to limit the Cc's to the ones that are listed as maintainers and the people with the most commits. It's definitely easier once you know who everyone is ;-)
<modwizcode>
I wonder how anyone even keeps up with the CC volume.
<arnd>
I tend to use 'git send-email --to-cmd="./scripts/get_maintainer.pl -i --no-git --no-git-fallback --m --no-r --no-l" --cc-cmd="./scripts/get_maintainer.pl -i --git --r --l"'
<maz>
we're really good an ignoring email! :D
<maz>
at*
<arnd>
and the with 'to' I only pick the names that are the people that I expect to eventually apply the patch, and with Cc I pick whatever seems most appropriate
<modwizcode>
When I sent patches off to QEMU (which borrows the linux process I think generally), I sent them to nobody (or myself) and CC'd people from get_maintainer.pl
<arnd>
git-send-email will leave out the duplicates from cc
<modwizcode>
That's nice of it
<modwizcode>
Do you use any client in particular for replies btw?
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<arnd>
I used to have a script that takes adds everyone who added a Reviewed-by/Acked-by/Signed-off-by/etc tag to the original patch referred to by a 'Fixes: abcd12345678 ("commit shortlog")' line, but now this is done automatically
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<marcan>
ah, didn't know that. neat.
<arnd>
modwizcode: the address I send from redirects to gmail, so I just use that for replying. It's not great, but I got stuck with it after a previous job required using it, and I have never started using mutt
<modwizcode>
Ah
<marcan>
I use thunderbird myself fwiw
<modwizcode>
I use gmail too since my domain email is still handled there (saves me from setting up verification keys and such which seems to get ever harder)
<modwizcode>
I just feel annoyed because gmail includes entire reply chain by default which leads to ever growing emails
<modwizcode>
I've wondered if that might annoying maintainers
<arnd>
modwizcode: it certainly does, you have to trim that manually, but that is the same as with any other client
<marcan>
no inline replies?
<marcan>
for inline replies trimming is kind of implied, no?
<modwizcode>
That's what I've been doing.
<modwizcode>
Inline replies are annoying because gmail wraps a little visual sugar around it that makes it hard to edit
<modwizcode>
Like you can do them, but it's frustrating, to the point where I was wondering if I was doing it wrong
<arnd>
the annoying bit with gmail is that it adds a couple of empty lines above the quote and puts your cursor there, so you have to trim both the extra newlines and the unneeded text
<arnd>
it also occasionally goes back to html replies for me instead of plain text, so the replies get silently dropped by many mailing lists
<modwizcode>
Yeah I'm 99% sure that gmail always includes a second html copy
<modwizcode>
I was checking my replies and even in plain text mode it seems to include that
<kettenis>
marcan: 1.5M is somewhat annoying as a default baudrate for a serial console
<kettenis>
many usb-to-serial converters don't support it and at a connection at that speed is quite susceptible to line noise
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<kettenis>
I can see why you want it for uploading binaries, but as a default 115200 would be better
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<arnd>
I would also suggest 115200 as the default in the dts file if the driver requires one, but allow the bootloader to override it with whatever it uses for the uart itself. Having the bootloader and the kernel use different rates would be worse than either default
<marcan>
I'll check to see if I can make it just keep the existing baud rate, and switch to 115200 otherwise
<kettenis>
that should work; most DTs don't specify a baudrate
<opticron>
marcan, if you haven't figured out your reverse-sshfs conundrum yet, https://github.com/Overv/outrun might provide some of the pieces you need
<arnd>
marcan: I don't think davem minds me picking up that oneline change
<arnd>
I frequently do cross-architecture changes like that through the asm-generic tree
<arnd>
note that sparc32 is pretty much unmaintained except for the Cobham Gaisler LEON CPU part that is missing a number of patches, while the sparc64 port hasn't seen much work in the past few years either but at least still is still usable on workstations.
<arnd>
we used to not include asm-generic/io.h anywhere at all, it took a while to creep into all architectures except for the least actively maintained ones
<Glanzmann>
b/whois arnd
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<gruetzkopf>
i should poke at 32bit sparc some more
<marcan>
arnd: good to know :)
<tarzeau>
if only i could get a sparcstation 20 or so, i'd run openstep on it
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<kettenis>
good luck finding an ss20 with a working idprom
<tarzeau>
glad there's still gnustep.org, fine enough, but all the apps are missing
<dottedmag>
marcan: Thanks, snatched the last (!) discounted 4x bundle
<dottedmag>
(solo v2)
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