rz2k changed the topic of #linux-sunxi to: Allwinner/sunxi development discussion - Don't ask to ask. Just ask and wait! - See http://linux-sunxi.org | https://github.com/linux-sunxi/ | Logs at http://irclog.whitequark.org/linux-sunxi | FOSDEM talks - http://dl.linux-sunxi.org/users/nove/sunxi_at_fosdem2014/
<hno> Nazcafan mtd is the generic flash driver subsystem in Linux.
<Nazcafan> ok, so let me get this straight
<hno> there is no straight in this topic.
<Nazcafan> nand is some kind of low level memory, whereas flash devices (sdcards) are higher level, and thus are much easier to handle, is this correct?
<hno> NAND is low-level flash chips. SD-Cards are NAND chips + RAM + CPU + firmware presenting the NAND as a normal block device.
<Nazcafan> which means much less code in order to support it correctly?
<hno> USB sticks is pretty much the same thing in different packaging.
<Nazcafan> and it is troublesome to have proper nand support for sunxi, or is it?
<hno> Supporting SD-Cards is many orders of magnitute simpler than NAND, and more importanly works exactly the same no matter what brand or size of sd card you have.
<hno> With bare NAND chips a lot differ depending on what exact chip you have.
<Nazcafan> what is libnand, and how does it relate or not to mtd? is libnand some sort of userspace thing?
<Nazcafan> (warning: absolute newbie here)
<hno> libnand is allwinners NAND driver. Found in their bootloader, u-boot, livesuit (the device side parts of it) and linux-kernel.
<hno> most versions are distributed as binary blobs only.
<hno> and 99.99% of all livesuit images you find are GPL violating from it.
<Nazcafan> and I guess the blob is different for each device/soc?
<hno> no
<Nazcafan> ah
<hno> but exists in several incompatible versions.
<Nazcafan> incompatible?
<hno> but yes it is partly SoC dependent.
<Nazcafan> do you mean non-interchangeable with respect to the kernel they are shipped with?
<hno> incompatible == can't access a flash chip formatted with another version and will most times silently reformat the flash erasing any content.
<Nazcafan> aaah
<Nazcafan> that's mean!
<hno> we do have source of two versions, which both works across the SoC versions.
<Nazcafan> so how does the sunxi kernel addresses the nand support problematic?
<Nazcafan> (ah, this answers partly my last question, I guess)
<randomblame> had to run for a bit - did anyone find the 4.4 sdk for a23?
<randomblame> or is it not in the hands of the community yet
<Nazcafan> do you use the source for the sunxi-kernel?
<hno> I ignore it, and try to document the hardware so another driver can be written.
<hno> the hardware manual have a very extensive documentation of the nand controller which basically says "there is a NAND controller".
<Nazcafan> I have my last newbie question before I go to bed (don't want to be a zombie at work tomorrow)
<Nazcafan> on PC platform, I can install several kernels on the same machine and select the one I want at boot time through grub
<hno> yes, same here using u-boot, just that you don't have a fancy menu.
<Nazcafan> I can live without the fancy menu
<Nazcafan> why did the allwiner guys decide to go for a kernel module for the live suite? ain't usblib easier to use?
<hno> don't know. The module can be replaced by a LD_PRELOAD wrapper using libusb.
<hno> the module doesn't do anything useful
<hno> Nazcafan, we do have full FEL boot mechanism implemented to boot whatever you like over USB-FEL. See http://linux-sunxi.org/FEL/USBBoot
<Nazcafan> did you document the FEL protocol anywhere?
<Turl> Nazcafan: there's always the open source fel tool
<Turl> I don't know if there's any doc, maybe on the wiki
<Nazcafan> thanks for all the info guys
<Nazcafan> good night
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<hno> I did..
<hno> and then embodied in the fel tool.
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<randomblame> does anyone have an a20/a23 device tree for 4.3/4.4 ?
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<Turl> hno: a link to that on the wiki fel page would be nice
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<arete74> on the wiki i have this warning: apc_store():Potential cache slam averted for key 'sunxi-mw:user:id:12'
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<oliv3r> libv: both! i do wanna use it as a tablet too :) but i guess just a dev device is still nice :(
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<rellla> morning
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<oliv3r> Turl: FEL page updated ;)
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<hno> oliv3r, thanks
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<geecko> rz2k, any chance that r3p2-01rel0 blobs would work with 01rel3 kernel driver ?
<geecko> rz2k, we're trying to switch to dma-buf on the exynos4 kernel
<rz2k> geecko: https://github.com/rzk/linux-odroid/commits/odroid-3.8.y dma-buf r3p2 for odroid
<geecko> rz2k, is there anything to change kernel-side to support dma-buf ?
<rz2k> r3p0 will not work with r3p2 because blobs check the version
<rz2k> no
<geecko> rz2k, it's r3p2-01rel0 blobs on r3p2-01rel3 kernel driver
<rz2k> oh, then check api version on mali_utgard.h
<geecko> rz2k, i did that. you think it would work just by changing api version?
<rz2k> blobs ioctl api version definition from there
<geecko> yeah i know
<rz2k> should work
<geecko> nice.
<geecko> rz2k, i backported ION driver from the 3.4 kernel, switching to dma-buf on mali, upgrading the framebuffer driver, and switching hwcomposer.
<geecko> lots of steps
<geecko> lots of chances to fail also :/
<geecko> it's for android of course.
<rz2k> hmm
<rz2k> I'm not sure about android, sorry
<geecko> rz2k, np ^^
<rz2k> never got deep into it
<geecko> rz2k, i booted the kernel with api version changed and UMP disabled, i have no errors on logcat or dmesg, but there's no display, and that was totally expected
<rz2k> go strace everything, I'm not sure how hwcomposer/surfaceflinger works with mali, so I cant help with that
<rz2k> and the gralloc stuff
<geecko> rz2k, it's pretty cool if the blobs run without modification on the kernel though :)
<rz2k> ls
<rz2k> whoops
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<geecko> rm -rf /
<geecko> wooooops !!
<rz2k> lol
<binaryferret> hehe
<geecko> dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sda
<geecko> :P
<geecko> don't try that :P
<Nyuutwo> dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/root - once I done that
<Nyuutwo> ...
<binaryferret> hehehe
<rz2k> geecko: with native linux I've been able to run different blobs version
<geecko> rz2k, different rels ?
<rz2k> r3p0 kernel and r3p2 blobs iirc
<geecko> haha, wtf !
<rz2k> but that was long ago
<geecko> ok so it should definitely work
<geecko> nice :D
<geecko> rz2k, oh btw, with dma-buf blobs, UMP will not work at all, right ?
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<rz2k> not sure, mali has atleast two memory zones available, trace when dma-buf gets invoked
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<libv> rellla: no-one has done anything to the disp ioctls since i created that list
<plaes> libv: how's your driver coming?
<libv> rellla: and that wiki page you are writing, there's no need to keep it under your own user
<libv> plaes: not at all atm, still not being very productive
<plaes> ok :(
<rellla> libv, i'll move it ... :p
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<libv> rellla: seems like you are doing good general work, so no need to keep it hidden away :)
<rellla> libv, it was late yesterday, so i preferred to do it in "playground" first ;)
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<libv> :)
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<libv> the mele a1000 page needs to be discussed...
<libv> there is one major stumbling block with respect to the multiple devices using pretty much the same motherboard
<libv> a major stumbling block towards turning it into a proper NDH style page
<libv> how do we deal with the the different devices?
<libv> mash them all together in one page, or have different pages, and let the A2000 and A100 just constantly refer to the A1000 ?
<libv> the second will get us: separate infoboxes, separate pictures, and separate listings in the device categories
<Turl> libv: all of those devices are pretty much the same
<libv> but it will require people to go to the first page for all the real info
<Turl> I think the current approach is the way to go
<Turl> make it all in one page
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<libv> then you do not get separate listings
<Turl> and maybe put a pic of each model if you really care
<libv> and it's harder to see the differences
<Turl> libv: wiki redirects :)
<Turl> there's no difference other than the case
<libv> Turl: how do redirects work with categories?
<Turl> I believe they show up on the list
<Turl> give it a try
<Turl> :)
<libv> heh, i need to find a redirecting page first to be able to copy off of it
<libv> i am all for separate pages atm
<libv> it has some small advantages, and it's a lot cleaner
<libv> just more work
<libv> heh, that doesn't show on the main page
<libv> it only shows on the separate category page
<Turl> libv: what's the main page?
<libv> at the bottom, expand the A10_HTPC category
<Turl> I see it
<Turl> maybe you have cached the old response or sth
<Turl> I didn't know they were expandable btw :P
<libv> ah, right, it shows it now, did you just add that mele a2000 page?
<libv> ah, yes
<Turl> libv: nah, it's been there for ages
<Turl> I just added the categories
<libv> ah, right
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<libv> let me see whether multiple infoboxes actually work
<Turl> libv: do you really think 3-4 infoboxes with the same content is going to be a nice solution?
<libv> the devices look different
<Turl> then just put more pics on there
<Turl> inside they're all the same :p
<libv> and there is a small difference between A1000 and A100
<libv> namely, lacking sata
<Turl> it doesn't lack it afaik
<libv> it's not soldered on
<Turl> just missing the connector
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<libv> anyway, let me get 3 infoboxes in, and then it can still be reverted if the solution isn't liked
<libv> i really love how easy it was to document hc860 and how clean the result looks
<libv> and imho the original mele(s) deserve the same treatment
<libv> ah, heh, that will not work...
<libv> the infobox comes from the page name.
<Turl> libv: document some olimex hw :)
<libv> no, i have let the mele slide for too long
<libv> and i am not awake enough to do coding
<Turl> haha
<Net147> libv: did you get those olimex boards yet?
<Turl> isn't it like afternoon over there? :)
<libv> Net147: largely, yes, but Tsvetan is coming to nue next week for embedded world and he will bring me an A13 board and an extra cable :)
<libv> Turl: yes, it's 14:00 :p
<Turl> libv: 10AM here, I can pull off that excuse, you can't :p
<Turl> wens: ping? :)
<Net147> libv: planning to add dual display support to the KMS driver?
<oliv3r> say hello to Tsvetan from me! :p
<libv> Net147: naturally.
<wens> Turl: pong
<Net147> libv: goodo
<libv> Turl: well, the only person who should care when i get up is my gf, but she knows how wildly my cycle varies
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<Turl> wens: I'm in taking patches mood :)
<libv> oliv3r: you can say that to Tsvetan here as well!
<Turl> wens: GMAC clock, anything else pending from you?
<wens> Turl: nope :)
<wens> I was in the hospital for minor surgery
<wens> didn't get much done afterwards
<Turl> oh
<Turl> wens: get well then :)
<wens> doing good :)
<oliv3r> libv: i said it to him allready :p
<Turl> mnemoc: I never got a reply from hans on the config stuff btw
<libv> oliv3r: what's your view on the mele A1000 page?
<oliv3r> let me look
<oliv3r> but now i'm not writing my chapter 3 :p
<oliv3r> it's not following the new device howto for sure
<Turl> oliv3r: got nothing from packt btw
<oliv3r> a little messy; the 'firmwares' are not htat interesting; the 'in the wild' vs the 'see also'?
<oliv3r> Turl: maybe they'll send you the whole thing in one go
<oliv3r> or they are so impressed with my writing they don't find it required :)
<Turl> pretty sure they said it'd be chapters
<Turl> :)
<oliv3r> i still haven't poked the ml for a 3rd reviewer :)
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<oliv3r> libv: but its starting to improve, so that's good
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<libv> oliv3r: any opinion towards 1 page versus multiple pages?
<libv> started at 13:49
<Turl> wens: hm
<Turl> wens: build says there's an unused i on sun7i_a20_gmac_clk_setup
<Turl> wens: did you handle that and I took and old patch?
<wens> Turl: I sent a v5 for that :)
<Turl> wens: just killing the i? or any other changes?
<Turl> I'd rather amend than pick everything again :p
<wens> just killing the i
<wens> v5 is only the clock patch
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<Turl> wens: http://sprunge.us/ADcd then :)
<wens> ok :)
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<wens> finally getting this out, I have like 10 branches on gmac
<plaes> nice
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<oliv3r> libv: hmm, good point; it's all the same hardware, but 'looks slightly different on the outside'
<oliv3r> libv: i'd go with a central a1000 page, and then link to it
<libv> oliv3r: but redirects, or 3 different pages, with separate infoboxes, separate pictures, but the A100/A2000 mostly referring to the A1000 page?
<oliv3r> well it'll probably be more recognizeable if they have their own pages with pictures
<oliv3r> and then a 'go read more about this here'
<oliv3r> ideally the content would be linked :)
<libv> who actually owns A2000 and A100?
<libv> because i will be creating hc860 style pictures later on of A1000
<libv> and it would be nice to have similar ones for the other two
<oliv3r> i have neither
<oliv3r> i want inside pics of m3 and m5 :p
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* plaes needs to create a20-olinuxino pics
<oliv3r> and lime pics
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<Turl> libv: I have a 2k I think
<Turl> it's in 'production' though, I'd rather not disassemble it for pictures :)
<Turl> I think mnemoc has one too (as well as a nice camera)
<libv> disassembly is not needed, just good pictures from all sides
<libv> to match hc860
<libv> but yeah, if it's running, keep it running
<libv> oliv3r: yeah, i should properly take pictures of the lime now that it is still unused
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<codekipper> libv: I have an A2000 already unscrewed and waiting to be photographed. I will give it a dust down first.
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<libv> codekipper: i think we have board pictures :)
<libv> codekipper: the pictures we'd need would be like the hc860 page
<Turl> the more the merrier, I'm not gonna say no to sunxi pictures, even if we have some already :)
<codekipper> libv: so top and all sides with some form of connection?, you're in luck as I was moments away from butching the sides to add a serial jack connection.
<libv> :)
<libv> codekipper: yeah, and a side view for the infobox
<codekipper> libv: Have you started with the Q8H yet?, I've got one on the way and I've been looking at the code. Just wondering if you've located the serial pins yet?
<libv> i am pretty certain that those two obvious pads are serial
<libv> just haven't changed the script.bin to test them yet
<libv> they really are way too obvious, and in such a case, they have never been wrong
<codekipper> libv: yep, they do stand out as contenders. I should also have a MK808C (with what also looks like obvious serial points) in the next few weeks.
<libv> codekipper: get a proper irc client going if you want to do more sunxi stuff :)
<libv> webchat is not the best or most reliable
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<codekipper> libv: will do once I've got around work's pr0xy
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<libv> :)
<libv> hrm, what did i use to tunnel out of nokia network...
<Turl> one of those proxy over DNS things? :)
<plaes> libv: corkscrew
<libv> exactly :)
* libv was digging through ancient irclogs
<libv> codekipper: codescrew is the ticket
<plaes> I was in there too :P
<libv> :)
<libv> corkscrew even
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<codekipper> libv: I'm using squid at the mo for other things...I will have a little play with that and corkscrew, if all fails then fat fingers will be reaching for an android client
<Tartarus> hey hno, any plans to submit u-boot stuff upstream again soon?
<Turl> Tartarus: there was a discussion about that on the ML these last days, be sure to read it
<Turl> yeah there
<Turl> this thread iirc, althought they may be more in another one
<Turl> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/linux-sunxi/longer$20link/linux-sunxi/y2de2h1wA7w/N5wH_tc5vJ0J
<mripard> Tartarus: yeah, we discussed this at FOSDEM
<mripard> you should see some patches soon
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<Tartarus> OK, good
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<hno> Tartarus, there is always plans, just a bit short on time.
<hno> Turl, nice, but wrong SoC and wrong GPU for this channel..
<Turl> hno: I know :)
<Turl> hno: busy with $job these days?
<hno> job and 7 kids. But at least manages to keep up with the mail flow now so things are improving.
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<Turl> :)
<Turl> hno: mnemoc is still playing catch-up with the mail
<hno> Turl, I gave up. Moved some 15K emails to some dark corner on my mail server.
<hno> life much easier that way
<Turl> +4
<Turl> +1 too
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<nove> i don't understand those comments like that, they look to be unformed but there is always something missing
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<nove> informed*
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<nove> for what is almost one developer work, yes jemk is the one that is doing must of the work, the progress is being very good, good job jemk
<nove> if the user only knows wait and complain, then wait and complain, for my part i will not touch a finger in that xbmc
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<nove> i have better things to do than spend my time doing half baked solutions, just that the user can have it now
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<bertrik> is there still stuff that I can help working on for an Olimex A10-lime board?
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<nove> the problem of xbmc is not only the cedar hardware, but also the display and the 3d rendering
<nove> it will be ready when is ready
<arete74> hi, is possible from u-boot check the status of an gpio pin?
<ssvb> nove: yeah, the commenters are rather clueless, but this is to be expected
<ssvb> nove: the oliver's FOSDEM talk and this cnx article are supposed to 'educate' them, but this is going to take time
<Turl> arete74: uboot has a gpio command I think
<ssvb> heh, not everything seems to be working nicely in 3.4.79: [ 6840.617538] INFO: task glmark2-es2:963 blocked for more than 120 seconds.
* ssvb suspects that cma might be somehow responsible
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<arete74> turl: thanks
<oliv3r> mripard: are you writing patches? :)
<oliv3r> (u-boot upstream)
<oliv3r> Oliver Schinagl, a member of linux-sunxi community working on open source kernel and bootloader for
<oliv3r> he got my name wrong :p
<Turl> oliv3r: even you do
<Turl> don't complain
<Turl> :p
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<oliv3r> lol
<oliv3r> i do
<oliv3r> right; time to set some comments straight and read
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<mnemoc> oliv3r: accept it, you are oliver now
<Turl> time to ask the govt to accept your name change :)
<plaes> :D
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<hno> arete74, yes the gpio command can both set and read any gpio capable pin on the processor.
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<Nazcafan> hi everyone
<hno> oliv3r, regarding secure boot. It should work fully, and if you encrypt it all then there is no big issue with allowing other boot methods in terms of information security
<Turl> hno: it's not secure if you can run arbitrary code
<hno> also from A20 onwards there is some efuses to lock things down quite a bit, including secure bootmode where brom requires encrypted bootloader.
<hno> possibly also exists for earlier generations, documentation quite incomplete in this area.
<hno> A20 SID manual also mentions HDCP key btw, but a little unclear on where that is stored.
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