Turl changed the topic of #linux-sunxi to: Allwinner/sunxi development discussion - Don't ask to ask. Just ask and wait! - See http://linux-sunxi.org | https://github.com/linux-sunxi/ | Logs at http://irclog.whitequark.org/linux-sunxi
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<libv> yay. toys.
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<mnemoc> libv: your camera arrived?
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<hero100> what is the advantage of 1G/3G user/kernel split? I saw it in real time kernel
<libv> yeah, and a hyundai a7
<libv> and sd-cards
<libv> and cycling underpants :p
<tomcheng86> hi , any way to check the version of A20 chip ? it is covered by a heat sink, so i want a software way to do it
<mripard> hero100: the advantage over what?
<hero100> 1G/3G user/kernel split over 3G/1G user/kernel split
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<mripard> you can map more areas in the kernel, reducing the need for highmem
<mripard> but you only have 1G of virtual memory for the applications
<mripard> which is tight
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<hero100> I want to use the cubieboard2 for real time control, 1G of virtual memory is not a big problem
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<libv> i have done so many NDHs that it just takes a bit over an hour to do one.
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<libv> well, 2h including full web dig and pics
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<libv> hrm, we get very few new boards added to sunxi-boards
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<megal0maniac_afk> Are there Windows drivers for FEL mode?
<mmarker> Hmm. Is this the right place to discuss more enduser-ish issues with u-boot on sun4i boards?
<libv> mmarker: just ask your question
<megal0maniac_afk> Ah, PhoenixSuite has them
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<megal0maniac_afk> Not that it helps. PhoenixSuite doesn't care about the fel device :/
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<mmarker> Long story short: can't get an recent pull from u-boot/sunxi github to respect my settings in boot.scr and uEnv.txt. Also, haven't soldered in a serial cable yet, and wondering if there is a way to dump uboot output to text to view after the kernel boots.
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<libv> mmarker: solder a serial cable first :) it saves you soo much pain later :)
<libv> mmarker: what hardware is this?
<mmarker> Its an offbrand mk802 1gb model. I know what I'd need to do to solder it, but need to get the goods to do it.
* megal0maniac_afk still can't believe the ridiculous cable he made yesterday
<libv> mmarker: check this page: http://linux-sunxi.org/Rikomagic_mk802%2B
<libv> does it have the same case and the same motherboard?
<libv> anyway, i am just bringing up hyundai A7 (which i recevied a few h ago, and which i documented just now), so let's see whether recent u-boot respects boot.scr
* megal0maniac_afk bows to the wiki wizard
<mmarker> Yea. Looks the same. What I expected as well.
<libv> i just offed the head of a toothbrush :p
<libv> now working the pictures
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: Did you get the message about itead mirroring the pinout?
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: i read it, and i hoped that you would go and fix it in the picture :)
<libv> also, what was that with itead and iteaduino?
<megal0maniac_afk> One sec
<libv> is this ibox an itead ibox or an itead iteaduino ibox?
<megal0maniac_afk> Itead Studio (or Itead for short) is the manufacturer. Iteaduino is a product, IBOX is another product
<megal0maniac_afk> (Iteaduino plus, rather)
<megal0maniac_afk> Was referring to the filename for the pinout, which is Iteaduino_ibox_uart.jpg
<libv> ah, ok
<libv> just rename it then :)
<libv> nice to know that i am not the only one nitpicking ;)
<megal0maniac_afk> I shall. Just wanted you to know :P
<megal0maniac_afk> Still can't believe they messed up the pinout :/
<libv> .cn
<megal0maniac_afk> Shhh!
<libv> mmarker: so it isn't really that off-brand then :)
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<mmarker> Yup. Case is different labeling, but the guts are the same.
<libv> mmarker: what's on the case?
<libv> mmarker: also, what do the android identification strings tell you?
<libv> does it state MK802 or MK802+ or nothing at all?
<libv> Just mini pc android blahblah
<mmarker> Oh, let me boot into android, but the case lacks minipc. Just says android 4.0 mini PC.
<libv> mmarker: we wouldn't mind having a picture of that as well :)
<mmarker> I'll snag one. Where should it go?
<mmarker> And android is booting now.
<libv> edit it down to just the device, and scale it to something reasonable
<libv> then upload it to: http://linux-sunxi.org/Special:Upload
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<mmarker> No problem. And let me get the model number. Its different than what's on the wiki
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<libv> yeah, those things tend to change with different images
<sehraf> https://github.com/linux-sunxi/u-boot-sunxi doesn't work with a nand installation yet, does it?
<Turl> sehraf: not the sunxi branch, but you can use the lichee-dev branches for nand
<sehraf> ok, thx
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<libv> sehraf: there's a wiki page for that.
<Turl> "The Alphabet (or, the sorting of Kconfig symbols)" on lakml :P
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: Does this mean anything to you? http://i.imgur.com/OYIKqiP.jpg
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<libv> megal0maniac_afk: is that some display output from your ibox?
<sehraf> libv: thx - that is the page i was lokking for
<libv> sehraf: did you try searching our wiki for "nand"?
<sehraf> no - i searched for uboot :P
<sehraf> and had a look at the page for the cubietruck
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<mmarker> Image uploaded.
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: Yes. It does that when it doesn't want to boot from NAND
<megal0maniac_afk> In full 720p glory
<libv> sehraf: hrm, you are right, the u-boot page could use a fix-up there.
<sehraf> ;)
<megal0maniac_afk> I will beat the China out of this thing!
<libv> hrm, i still do not have a 1000 edits on our wiki
<libv> getting close though
<Turl> ssvb: now that you're familiar with the axp driver, is there any chance you can look into why battery monitors fail with it? :)
<ssvb> Turl: yes, I can have a look
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<ssvb> but this AXP stuff is a bit strange, the bits which should enable/disable ADCs apparently have no effect
<wens> what happens if you disable them? do the values still change?
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<ssvb> also on the cubieboards, ACIN and VBUS seem to be shorted, but AXP does not set the bit which should provide information about this...
<wens> libv: the A23 seems to have an extra UART, I'm guessing that's the one on the q8h
<Turl> ssvb: the fact that stuff seems to be commented out on axp_battery_get_property is shady
<wens> ssvb: they are not shorted from the AXP's view
<ssvb> wens: yes, the voltage/current values seem to be reasonable even with ADCs disabled, this puzzles me a bit
<wens> ssvb: maybe it's a "pause" switch?
<libv> wens: aha.
<libv> wens: i will be taking external pictures of q8h today as well, so its page can be completed
<libv> wens: let's hope your guess is right :)
<ssvb> wens: can you explain this thing about ACIN and VBUS shorting in more detail?
<wens> libv: I'm poking around u-boot to see if I can't get SPL working, then we can test that :)
<libv> wens: if not, we have another rev 1 of the semitime g2 on our hands
<ssvb> wens: unfortunately I'm mostly just a software guy
<wens> ssvb: if you look at the schematics, AXP takes ACIN from the DC-5V tap, which is before a diode
<wens> AXP takes VBUS from OTG-VBUS
<wens> DC-5V and OTG-VBUS both have a diode before merging into VCC-5V
<wens> so current cannot flow from VBUS to ACIN, or vice versa
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<ssvb> wens: really? I wonder why I'm measuring low resistance between the central pin of the barrel power connector and the VBUS pin on the USB cable connected to OTG
<ssvb> wens: also AXP reports 5V on ACIN and 0V on VBUS when I'm powering the board from OTG
<wens> maybe I'm mistaken then...
<wens> anyway that's what the schematics say
<wens> I don't have my hardware around to actually test it
<ssvb> wens: I'm getting just ~0.7 ohms in either direction
<wens> maybe someone swapped the diode for a resistor
<megal0maniac_afk> Might that not be the 0.7V drop over the diodes?
<ssvb> wens (or anybody else): about the cubieboard schematics, do I understand it right that 1.5V DDR3 power line is bypassing AXP there?
<ssvb> megal0maniac_afk: more like the resistance of my mini-USB cable
<ssvb> megal0maniac_afk: google seems to say that it is the right order of magnitude - http://www.yoctopuce.com/EN/article/usb-cables-size-matters
<megal0maniac_afk> ssvb: You'll also get lead resistance if you touch your multimeter leads together
<megal0maniac_afk> But if you happen to be on the diode scale on your multimeter, it will show you the forward voltage drop
<megal0maniac_afk> Dammit!
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<megal0maniac_afk> Following http://linux-sunxi.org/Cubieboard/Installing_on_NAND word for word gives me the stupid green and red bar
<wens> ssvb: that's right
<libv> hrm, i probably should do pictures of clips as well.
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<libv> megal0maniac_afk: hrm
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<megal0maniac_afk> Sorry, got disconnected
<megal0maniac_afk> http://pastebin.com/mYpewZzn
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: "mbr not exist"
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: something is wrong with your partitioning
<megal0maniac_afk> Well, the first u-boot looks like the one that was there originally
<megal0maniac_afk> Second one is new
<megal0maniac_afk> Then there's a 520kb vfat partition, and a 4gb rootfs
<megal0maniac_afk> ext4
<Turl> megal0maniac_afk: you used nand-part to partition right?
<megal0maniac_afk> Turl: No
<Turl> and not fdisk or sth else
<megal0maniac_afk> I was lead to believe that dd-ing the image would sort out u-boot and partitions
<Turl> dd'ing what image?
* Turl doesn't know about that
<megal0maniac_afk> Neither do I :P
<ssvb> megal0maniac_afk: on the diode scale I'm getting zero volts in both directions
<ssvb> megal0maniac_afk: do you have a cubieboard? can you check yours?
<megal0maniac_afk> ssvb: I have an ibox
<megal0maniac_afk> One of 14 in the world, so support is limited :P
<megal0maniac_afk> But that sounds right then. No diode, just lead resistances
<ssvb> megal0maniac_afk: maybe I can try to find these diodes on the PCB, but for this I need to extract my cubieboard2 out of the plastic box
<wens> doesn't the plastic box give you a very loose connection on otg?
<ssvb> megal0maniac_afk: removing screws, too much hassle
<ssvb> megal0maniac_afk: I have "upgraded" my box to solve this problem :)
<megal0maniac_afk> Oh yeah?
<megal0maniac_afk> Magnets? :P
<libv> now, don't i ever hear or read about people using a screwdriver ever again
<megal0maniac_afk> "This protected your gums, but it will now protect your clips instead"
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: Oh, you :P
<Wizzup> hehehehe
<libv> *blush*
<ssvb> megal0maniac_afk: just cut off the extra plastic around the connector
<megal0maniac_afk> Will PhoenixSuite be able to mess with NAND if Android is booted off an SD card?
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<megal0maniac_afk> ssvb: This is also a bit of a pain to get in/out of the box. But I try not to need to
<megal0maniac_afk> IBOX might be short for In-Box
<megal0maniac_afk> :D
<megal0maniac_afk> I tried dd-ing a NAND image directly to /dev/nand but it doesn't work
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: yes, because a part of nand is accessed differently
<megal0maniac_afk> Well, it works fine but it doesn't boot :)
<megal0maniac_afk> Tried an Android SD card image, I get 3 lines on the console and that's all
<libv> what does nand_part tell you?
<libv> or are you no longer able to boot this device with a linux sd card?
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<megal0maniac_afk> Not currently. Busy burning cubieez to a card
<megal0maniac_afk> nand_part wasn't installed on the previous linux
<megal0maniac_afk> (And then I burned Android)
<megal0maniac_afk> My Dockstar loves me :P
<megal0maniac_afk> Nice and simple
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: all those also seem very specific tools
<libv> _and_ openwrt provides all of them in situ
<libv> ah, and it has a proper mtd driver
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: again, we are in a totally different league on sunxi
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: I've noticed :)
<libv> mmarker: wow, that's really highly compressed :)
<megal0maniac_afk> All the tools there are in uboot though, nothing fancy
<libv> mmarker: i just meant that you shouldn't make it 15MP with loads of extra stuff surrounding the actual device :)
<mmarker> Well, its mostly a flat black. Why spend the bits? :D
<libv> :)
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<mmarker> And uboot is still being a petulant child. Have to wait until I get to my soldering iron it looks like
<megal0maniac_afk> Haha wow. 7kb
<libv> it's fine, it shows the differing lettering quite clearly
<megal0maniac_afk> I wasn't moaning :)
<libv> mmarker: i will get to building uboot and running it today still, as otherwise i will not be pushing my patches, so i will provide you with some feedback today still
<libv> just doing several things at once (Well, mostly editing the wiki)
<mmarker> No worries. I know the value of a good serial console (eyes pile of ARM gear)
<megal0maniac_afk> No nand_part here either :/
<megal0maniac_afk> fffffffffffff
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: it's in sunxi-tools
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: as is clearly stated on the nand wiki page
<megal0maniac_afk> Yip
<megal0maniac_afk> Just thought it might be included
<megal0maniac_afk> s/thought/hoped
<libv> nope, that's a sunxi specific tool
<megal0maniac_afk> This is a sunxi specific image
<libv> you cannot put off getting a toolchain any longer
<libv> it's not as much hassle as you'd think
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: No, I know. My dockstar was even part of the build farm for Rockbox for a while :P
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<megal0maniac_afk> 2nd slowest client I think
<mmarker> Dockstar. Kids these days. I was porting Mozilla (not Firefox) on a Netwinder.
<mmarker> And yes, we had to walk uphill both ways in the snow.
<mmarker> Oh. And looking at the wiki. My internals on this 1g stick match the original mk802, the serial pad layout is the same
<megal0maniac_afk> mmarker: The dockstars have gigabit networking and cost $30. And they're easier to hack than "development platforms" :P
<ssvb> mmarker: how much RAN did it have?
<ssvb> *RAM
<mmarker> Mine I think had 256megs. Standard config was 128
<megal0maniac_afk> Dockstar only has 128
<megal0maniac_afk> That's probably the biggest shortfall. That, and lack of floating point support
<megal0maniac_afk> Well, FPU
<ssvb> mmarker: oh, then it was not that much of a challenge :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MicroB was officially shipped on devices with 128MB (Nokia N800) and even unofficially on 64MB (Nokia 770)
<ssvb> mmarker: the latter did not have FPU either
<mmarker> StrongARM didn't have an FPU either.
<mmarker> And clocked at a whopping 275mhz clock. Vrooom!
<ssvb> but the Internet used to be a bit different (lighter on resources) back in the days :)
<mmarker> And note. Not just running. Compiling the lizard. :D
<ssvb> compiling? why?
<mmarker> Ssvb: someone had to port Mozilla to arm!
<Wizzup> what is 'mozilla'?
<mmarker> And GCC in those days - arm support was not so hot, and cross compiling worse.
<Wizzup> Firefox works fine on arm
<mru> 'mozilla' was the name of the original open source release of netscape
<mmarker> Kids these days! This was pre-firefox. Porting the JS core and XPCOM was a royal pita.
<mru> mozilla was also the internal name of the netscape browser
<mmarker> Yup
<Wizzup> I know what the mozilla suite was
<mru> oh god, the old js core
<mru> so many bugs
<Wizzup> It's just that calling it mozilla is very ambigious
<mru> 'mozilla' was the name
<Wizzup> Yes, and you should add more because it is quite ambigious
<mru> I think they abandoned it after the 1.2 release
<megal0maniac_afk> :D
<megal0maniac_afk> fatal: destination path 'sunxi-tools' already exists and is not an empty directory.
<mmarker> Mru: lots of the guts stuck around. I remember the pain of NSS making some lameass assumptions. And thanks to netbsd, there were about a bazillion arm defines tossed in the JS code since some ARM engineer thought it would be funny to have a byteorder on floating point different from everything else.
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: http://pastebin.com/9NZEXvSK
<mmarker> And, of course, netbsd and Linux can't use the same defines. Oh no!
<mru> yes, the old fpa that used with a few rare armv4t cores
<mru> gcc softfloat was compatible with it though
<mru> then along came vfp
<mru> and suddently the word order of a double was sane
<megal0maniac_afk> HALP
<megal0maniac_afk> I am hardware guy
<megal0maniac_afk> I can't know this nand part things
<mru> and the ifdefs were all wrong
<mru> fun times
<mru> even more fun was the bug you got if you ran out of memory when the js engine attempted a specific allocation
<mru> it would try to throw some kind of js exception to signal this
<mru> allocating the exception object would also fail
<mru> which it tried to report by throwing an exception
<mru> etc
<mru> until the stack blew up
<libv> wasn't there a difference between a10 and a20 libnand?
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* megal0maniac_afk terrified
<Turl> wens: do the values look sane enough? http://sprunge.us/dUQW
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: read the wiki :)
<Turl> w 3
<Turl> w 3
<Turl> arrrgh
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* rellla hopes, that libv hasn't recently used this toothbrush ...
<ssvb> wickwire: just remembered something, was it your cubieboard2 that had Qt5 blowing up with dram clocked at 480mhz?
<wickwire> ssvb: yes, I suspect it was
<ssvb> wickwire: what dram clock speed are you using now?
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<libv> rellla: i have
<libv> rellla: but not anywhere near my mouth :p
<Turl> libv: good, good
<Turl> :P
<rellla> libv: lol
<wickwire> good question, I'll have a look
<ssvb> wickwire: it would be nice if you could:
<ssvb> wickwire: 1) revert dram clock speed back to 480mhz
<Turl> ssvb: axp and upower seem to be playing ball now with a bunch of changes :)
<ssvb> wickwire: 2) confirm that https://github.com/ssvb/lima-memtester/ easily detects this memory instability
<wickwire> ssvb: ok I'll do it as soon as possible
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<ssvb> wickwire: 3) then try increasing "dcdc3_vol" value in your fex file to 1300 and check if this helps to pass the test
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<ssvb> Turl: on sunxi-3.4? with what kind of changes?
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<ssvb> ccaione: are you working on the AXP support in the mainline kernel, right?
<Turl> first hunk fixes the units
<Turl> second hunk gets upower happy
<wens> Turl: what do mean by sane?
<Turl> wens: is 2.6Wh for a battery ok?
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: I give up, for now. Maybe I'll tunnel my serial connection over ssh, give someone an IP address, credentials, and $5 to do it for me :P
<wens> that depends on your battery?
<Turl> wens: china tablet battery
<wens> no clue :(
<Turl> wens: I mean more or less, is it in the ballpark for a battery? or would they normally be more like 260Wh or 0.1Wh?
<Turl> that data is pulled from the fex, just making sure the unit conversion is alright
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<libv> megal0maniac_afk: read those wiki links.
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: I AM
<Turl> ssvb: ~1A draw with screen on, half that with it off (at 3.9V)
<megal0maniac_afk> But there's too much of it that doesn't make sense
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: you have an A20
<megal0maniac_afk> So it will take a while
<megal0maniac_afk> Yes
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: yet the mbr version reads: 0x00000100
<megal0maniac_afk> I wouldn't know to look for that, or why
<megal0maniac_afk> But yes
<ssvb> Turl: which device and on what workload?
<Turl> ssvb: 10" tablet, idling on GDM
<Turl> with wifi on
<libv> i admit, it should shout louder about the difference
<Turl> perf governor iirc
<libv> but it's in there
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: Okay, so it isn't A20 specific formatting, I should format manually and specify A20?
<Turl> brightness is probably topped up
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: yup
<libv> nand-part is a very very dumb tool
<megal0maniac_afk> Block size is 2048 from that example
<libv> you did make a copy of the start of /dev/nand, as described in that howto, right?
<megal0maniac_afk> No, because I didn't follow that howto
<libv> what howto did you follow?
<libv> the wiki is there for a reason.
<megal0maniac_afk> I mish-mash of different instructions
<megal0maniac_afk> *A
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<ssvb> btw, does anyone have any tool for axp and a20 chips temperature measurement?
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<wens> Turl: I have no idea how to calculate absolute energy for a battery :(
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<ssvb> it would be nice to confirm if the thermal sensors are actually showing non-bullshit numbers
<Montjoie> ssvb, for AXP the numbers are from the datasheet
<Montjoie> for the sensor enbdeded in the TS, it is a guess (see my old patch for it)
<ssvb> Montjoie: yes, for the TP sensor I'm getting strange results on A10, it starts from around 100C on idle
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<ssvb> Montjoie: on A20 it seems to somewhat be believable, but still it would be nice to check it with some external temperature measurement tool
<Montjoie> the datasheet said nothing for the TP, so i have assumed that the calcul was the same, and for A20 it seems correct
<ssvb> Montjoie: right, and now imho it's time to get something more credible than just an assumption :)
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<ssvb> Montjoie: maybe mripard could add a clarification of the TP thermal sensor calibration to the list of questions for AW?
<ssvb> Montjoie: but if we can also independently measure something, then we should surely go for it
<wens> didn't know the SoC had a temp sensor
<ssvb> wens: I also kind of discovered it only yesterday :) http://www.cubieforums.com/index.php?topic=2293.msg14560#msg14560
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<ssvb> wens: but people were speculating about Montjoie's patches there, so it was a nice thing to finally learn about
<wens> ok, just looked at it
<wens> the TP sensor is the resistive touchpad controller
<ssvb> wens: I guess the assumption is that the TP controller has an ADC built-in for its own touchscreen purposes, but the very same ADC is also shared with the in-chip temperature sensor
<ssvb> but this assumption still has to be verified before we are really done with it
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<ssvb> especially considering that the results seem to be strange on A10
<ssvb> so anyone here with the temperature measurement tools? pretty much please...
<Turl> wens: can the axp (batt?) temp measurement be relied upon?
<Turl> the axp driver on 3.4 currently hardcodes "300"
<wens> Turl: that requires an external thermistor
<Turl> so that's a no then :)
<Turl> wonder why did they even bother reporting a fake number then :p
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<ssvb> Turl: is it used anywhere in some calculations or decision making?
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<Turl> ssvb: dunno, doesn't look like so on the axp driver
<Turl> ssvb: maybe userspace would want to shut down if temp is too high
<wens> probably some android stuff
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<libv> megal0maniac_afk: is the a20 version of the same partition table getting you anywhere?
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: I was in MacDonalds soldering a cable :D
<megal0maniac_afk> Now I'm back. The nand_part in the image was outdated and didn't support a20 switch, so I recompiled
<megal0maniac_afk> About to try
<megal0maniac_afk> (Wasn't soldering a cable for MacDonalds, just using their power :P)
<Wizzup> lol
<Turl> wait, you took a soldering iron to a mcdonalds
<megal0maniac_afk> I did
<Turl> opened your tablet there
<Turl> soldered it
<Turl> and left?
<Turl> lol
<megal0maniac_afk> NO, it was a power supply for someone else
<Turl> well, but you soldered something on a mcdonalds?
<megal0maniac_afk> But yes, that's more or less how it went. Prepped the wires in the car and went inside to finish the job
<megal0maniac_afk> Turl: Exactly
<Turl> someone should give you an achievement badge or something
<Turl> lol
<megal0maniac_afk> Wasn't able to test. Hope it works :/
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: mbr: version 0x00000200, magic softw411
<Turl> magic smoke would've started to raise some serious flags on there :)
<megal0maniac_afk> Turl: My solder is leaded, even
<megal0maniac_afk> OKAY
<megal0maniac_afk> Cubieboard2 has a link to Installing to NAND
<megal0maniac_afk> But it is applicable only to Cubieboard1 (because A10 partition table)
<megal0maniac_afk> So I'm removing the link. It just breaks things and confuses people like me
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<montjoie[home]> ssvb if mripard could ask AW, go for it
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<megal0maniac_afk> Is mtd a way of dealind with NAND flash, or is it an actual type of flash memory?
<Turl> ahci and usb have landed on torvalds/master :)
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<Turl> megal0maniac_afk: it's an abstraction layer on the kernel
<megal0maniac_afk> Okay, so it's only logical
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<megal0maniac_afk> Turl: Is there a reason that it isn't used for sunxi?
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: because allwinner implemented libnand, a higher level abstraction
<libv> due to apparently patents, linux does not have support for a block layer which works with nand/flash and which does wear levelling
<libv> so we are stuck with mtd, and filesystems on top implement the wear levelling
<Turl> also because AW suffers from NIH and maximizes code reuse to never before seen levels
<libv> mtd is being worked on, but it is not compatible with libnand, or will never be
<megal0maniac_afk> Fair enough. Given that we haven libnand, mtd shouldn't be urgent
<libv> megal0maniac_afk: it is urgent, as it holds us back
<megal0maniac_afk> It does?
<libv> why do we use an antique u-boot version?
<mru> wear levelling can probably be done more efficiently if coupled with the filesystem
<megal0maniac_afk> libv: Why do you think I know things? :P
<megal0maniac_afk> I assume because allwinner gave us binaries, and we don't have sources for libnand, nor support for mtd so we're stuck with an old version
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<ssvb> libv: from what I heard earlier here, the mainline nand support blocker is related to http://irclog.whitequark.org/linux-sunxi/search?q=bitflips
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<ssvb> basically, the modern nand hardware has broken some of the assumptions made in the current design of the mainline mtd related stuff
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<ssvb> the self-contained hackish driver, which does not rely on anything and just provides a block device is a quick and dirty short-term solution
<mru> ssvb: aka something we'll be stuck with for the foreseeable future :)
<mru> because nothing is more long-lived than a temporary hack
<ssvb> I guess, this works fine for AW and makes perfect sense for them
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<ssvb> oh, I even provided a bit wrong link, it's "program disturb" and "read disturb" that make things difficult - http://www.linux-mtd.infradead.org/doc/ubifs.html#L_ubifs_mlc
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<ssvb> mru: some passionate and skilled person might be needed to make things happen in the long run, the sunxi community just needs to attract more nand enthusiasts :)
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<libv> ssvb: ok :)
<libv> heh, the a20-cubie* stuff needs to be be moved to cubieboard2 and cubietruck, no suffix there.
<libv> working title apparently was a20-cubieboard, but now it's just cubieboard2 everywhere
* libv hopes that when all the cubie* olinuxino* and devices like the mk802 are in order, people will create better device pages.
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<Turl> libv: KMS? :)
<libv> jaja :p
<ccaione> wens: can I ask your help for a translation?
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<Turl> hey ccaione :)
<ccaione> hei Turl 0/ wassup
<Turl> ccaione: I'm playing with axp on 3.4 :p trying to make it work with upower
<ccaione> good luck with that :) BTW, suspendo support for axp in 3.4 is totally broken
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<Turl> ccaione: I got it more or less working, http://sprunge.us/AIIW?diff
<Turl> ccaione: I dunno if the energy now calculation is correct though; does axp provide that info in some direct way?
<ccaione> Turl: no idea about battery stuff since I have no hw
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<Turl> ccaione: no tablet or CT?
<ccaione> nop
<ccaione> just cb1 and cb2
<Turl> :(
<ccaione> I'm open for donations :D
<Turl> ccaione: weren't you on the list when they gave CT's to people here?
<ccaione> I think I missed that
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<kenny> Maybe a stupid question, but why can't you connect the VCC line for UART?
<mru> on which board?
<mru> and connect to what?
<Turl> kenny: because those tend to be 5V, and because it's not needed
<Turl> and probably some other reasons hw people can give you :)
<mru> incidentally, I'm using a level shifter where it is needed
<mru> got to be powered somehow
<kenny> what about between an RPi and a CB2? they should both be the same voltage, right? (I understand it's not needed, and works fine without it, just wondering)
<libv> kenny: simply don't bother, 99% of the cases it is fine
<mru> if you need to ask, don't connect it
<libv> but you definitely do not want to connect 5V to a 3.3V pad
<Turl> mnemoc: thx :)
<Turl> mru: wise advice
<kenny> haha
<libv> mnemoc: you don't have european citizenship, right?
* libv just got a letter telling him to chose between voting in .be or in .de
* mru has a similar letter
<mru> different choices
<mnemoc> libv: italian
<libv> mnemoc: really? heh, you've certainly seen a few corners of .eu then :)
<mnemoc> fewer than what I want, but yes
<libv> link in privmsg
<Turl> libv: do you have dual citizenship?
<libv> Turl: nope, i firmly believe that .eu citizenship is all that matters in the world
<libv> and that the fact that i am supposed to vote for the .be national government and cannot vote for a state at all, is horribly injust and undemocratic
* Turl is confused
<Turl> libv: so you're a .be citizen yet they let you vote for .de?
* mru sometimes considers applying for a 3rd citizenship
<mru> in the EU parliament elections you can vote according to citizenship or residence
<libv> Turl: as a belgian in germany, who's been there for 7 years, i can: vote for the city of nuernberg, cannot vote for the german state of bavaria, cannot vote for the german national parliament, but could vote for the belgian national parliament, and i can vote for the european parliament
<mru> but only for one country
<libv> so i lose the bavarian level
<libv> but if you look at it from the belgian point of view, i lose 2 levels
<libv> as you can vote for the dutch or french speaking "federal" parliaments, and for provinces
* Turl is now even more confused
<mru> I can vote in city and county elections in .uk, national in .se, either .uk or .se for eu elections
<libv> mru: stop paying taxes there
* mru is swedish citizen in .uk
<mru> taxes where?
<libv> mru: i have a dark brown suspicion that .uk is what is blocking this
<libv> like with most things .eu
<mru> blocking what?
<libv> the fact that you still have country citizenships and not a european citizenship
<libv> and that we both lose a level (at least)
<libv> you cannot vote for the county or whatever it is called that you live in
<mru> I can also vote for US president but that's entirely separate
<mru> libv: I can
<mru> city and county
<mru> not national
<libv> really?
<ccaione> mnemoc: italian???
<Turl> ccaione: many people in latam got es, it citizenships
<libv> then .uk is ahead of europe there? is your other citizenship .us?
<mru> I have .se and .us citizenships
<ccaione> Turl: why?
<mru> I could apply for .uk
<libv> mru: oh, you lose england/wales/scotland/whatever, right?
<Turl> ccaione: there's laws to get them if you have a grandparent that's es/it citizen or something
<mnemoc> ccaione: the italian law says that the child of an italian is italian, regardless where he/she is born
<mru> libv: there's no such thing
<libv> ok :)
<mru> there's a scottish parliament
<mru> and a welsh assembly
<Turl> ccaione: and european passports are usually more convenient to travel around
<mru> but nothing for england
<ccaione> mnemoc: are you son of italian parents?
<mru> I don't know who gets to vote for the scottish parliament
<mnemoc> ccaione: yes, both, but both born in .cl too :p
<ccaione> Turl: agree
<mru> I assume it requires at least residence
<ccaione> mnemoc: hahaha cool, you are a fellow italian then ;))
<mnemoc> ccaione: but my italian stinks :p
<libv> mru: ok, so only .uk is ahead of europe there, amazing
<ccaione> mnemoc: italian is the least useful language, so it is ok
<mru> the uk is a bit complicated
<Turl> ccaione: I sent the watchdog patch btw :p
<libv> yes :)
<mnemoc> ccaione: :)
<ccaione> Turl: thanks
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<mru> the non-england members of the uk have various degrees of autonomy which they exercise through their local parliaments/assemblies
<mru> but there is no specifically _english_ parliament
<libv> anyway, for those wondering, this was about the upcoming european elections
* mnemoc needs to update his anmeldung address :\
<libv> mnemoc: whut?
<libv> mnemoc: you moved inside berlin, or you still need to go to einwohnermeldeamt since you came there?
<mnemoc> inside berlin
<libv> ah, ok, it's still pretty important to do so though
<mnemoc> but i don't receive this kind of letters because I haven't updated my address
<mnemoc> yup
<libv> you do have the post forwarding letters, right?
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<mnemoc> yes, but important letters can't be forwarded
<libv> right
<mnemoc> ccaione: one annoying detail of my citizenship is that my italian passport has two surnames, as by chilean law :|
<mnemoc> ccaione: and that I can't get a resident ID card either in .es or .de beucase I'm EU citizen and I'm not supposed to need one, and otoh you can only get a italian id card while _living_ in .it ... so I have to carry the passport everywhere
<ccaione> mnemoc: It's a mess having two names in italy, I cannot imagine two surnames
<libv> mnemoc: that's another one of those things... if i need a new idcard or passport, i need to talk to the berlin embassy.
* mnemoc has two of each :|
<libv> it takes me about as long to travel to berlin as it does for brussels
<mnemoc> libv: but the .be consulate issues id cards?
<libv> yes
<libv> you probably need to talk to the italian consulate
<libv> which is only a metro ride away from you :p
<ccaione> mnemoc: you can be my guest in milan if you want to get an ID ;)
<mnemoc> ccaione: isn't it bound to the comune where you live?
<mnemoc> libv: indeed :)
<ccaione> mnemoc: yes, but after it has been issued you can relocate without having to modify it
<mnemoc> ah, nice
<mnemoc> ccaione: do they issue real cards yet or still with the cartolina?
<ccaione> for my ID I still live in bologna :)
<ccaione> mnemoc: I think you can ask for the electronic card. I have the cartolina
<libv> careful.
<libv> 7ys ago, .be had 75% moved to electronic already
<libv> i was, due to my name, one of the latter 25%
<libv> since i was moving to nue, i went to the communal administration and said "give me one of those fancy electronic ones, so i can just have it flashed when i am in .de"
<libv> "that's not how it works"
<libv> so i got issued with an old style id card, even though everyone else was getting rid of it
<libv> i am not sure whether, in the meantime, there are electronic id cards for .be expats
<mnemoc> libv: so I could get a german electronic id too?
<libv> and therefor, it could be that .it still uses fully paper ones as well
<libv> mnemoc: nope
<libv> mnemoc: depends on how italy handles its expats
<libv> a german id card is the last thing you get :)
* mnemoc hates to carry the passport
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<libv> that would've been easy, if your communal administration just issued a european electronic id card, but such a thing doesn't exist.
<libv> mnemoc: talk to the italian embassy :)
<libv> and find out :)
<mru> I have a swedish national id card
<mru> valid for travel anywhere in the schengen region
<libv> mru: since .uk is not schengen, you would kind of expect to have to deal with embassy all the time
<ccaione> "After more than 10 years of trials, the use of the electronic card is still limited to relatively few municipalities and the "online features" are not yet implemented"
<mru> libv: not really
<bertrik> my passport has rfid in it, even my finger prints in it electronically I think
<mru> I have to show my passport when entering
<ccaione> hahahah jesus, I hate being italian
<libv> ccaione: serves you right for having that clown for a priminister for that long ;p
<ccaione> libv: :(
heretic_ is now known as selsinork
<libv> a huge sigh of relief went through the world when he finally left the political stage :)
<ccaione> libv: actually he is still there. It cannot be elected, but unfortunately he is still there
<mru> you could shoot him...
<ccaione> mru: I'd like C_C
<libv> mru: nah, that just makes things worse
<mru> I mean, if someone were to shoot him...
<libv> people like that should peter out
<libv> mru: your .us nationality is showing through btw :p
<mru> or if he died in an unfortunate accident
<mru> isn't that how it's done in italy? :)
<libv> people who got killed or died in a tragic accident, become demigods overnight
<libv> hehe
<ccaione> mru: libv is right, more like american style
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<libv> anyway, glad to have him on his way out
<ccaione> me too. But I kind have lost hope and I'm moving abroad on january
<libv> ccaione: where to?
<ccaione> libv: dunno yet, it depends on my gf
<ccaione> she has asked for relocation at work
<mnemoc> finland?
<ccaione> for me it is easier to find a job
<ccaione> mnemoc: more likely london, amsterdam or sweden
<libv> helsinki is nice, but i wouldn't want to live there during those long dark winters
<libv> ccaione: no office in germany?
<libv> ccaione: that way you're pretty nearby italy still, but have the alps to separate you from them
<mnemoc> london and helsinki are just too expensive to be enjoyed imo
<ccaione> libv: in germany the hq is in Munich
<libv> ccaione: urgh. lederhosen. heimatsfeier. terrible.
<libv> otherwise a nice place to live, but too bad that it's full of bavarians :p
<ccaione> :H
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<mru> why would anyone move to sweden?
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<ccaione> mru: didn't you like sweden?
<mru> terrible climate and high taxes you get nothing in return for
<ccaione> really? I thought they have one of the best public services and welfare in europe
<mru> not any more
<ccaione> well, good to know before choosing where to move :D
<mru> but don't take my word for it
<mru> and all countries have some issue or other
<ccaione> I should ask hno
<mru> lots of factors to consider
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<lauri> Good evening guys, perhaps this is useful to someone, just wrote it: http://lauri.vosandi.com/blog/debian-jessie-sunxi-packages.html
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<Turl> libv: ^
<Turl> lauri: it's great to see all those packaged :)
<Turl> lauri: the picture of the whole setup seems to be broken btw
<lauri> fixing that
<lauri> fricking cacert https
<rm> worked for me :D
<lauri> pic visible now?
<rm> (Debian does support CAcert)
<Turl> yup :) awesome
<Turl> rm: not for long if my memory serves
<lauri> yeah CAcert is represented inconsistently in browsers
<lauri> anywho
<lauri> I am pretty satisfied with this setup right now, pretty usable on a daily basis
<Turl> lauri: are you using it as your main desktop?
<lauri> yeah
<lauri> mostly ssh & pluma &mpv
<Turl> lauri: cool
<Turl> lauri: do you have the OS on a SD card or SSD/HDD?
<lauri> SSD
<lauri> SD card and internal flash was too slow
<lauri> next step is NFS root
<lauri> unfortunately I am not Debian dev
<lauri> I would like to see most of my packages upstream :/
<Turl> there's a process to get them upstream, even if you're not a developer
<lauri> it would be great if you guys could have some "official" releases of sunxi-tools etc
<Turl> mnemoc: ^
<Turl> that shouldn't be an issue, we can tag stuff :)
<lauri> otherwise versioning will be a mess :/
<lauri> right now I just tagged them as 0.1
<lauri> whatever didn't have an official version
<mnemoc> Turl: it needs serious reorganization
<lauri> and fixed makefiles..
<lauri> install: blah were missing
<lauri> the source packages are available
<lauri> if you're interested :P
<Turl> lauri: we have that package repo, but mostly ubuntu oriented
<Turl> it'd be great to have debian packages
<mnemoc> Turl: push a tag and then github will serve tarballs for us
<Turl> and I don't think we have vdpau packages either, those could be built for ubuntu as well
<mnemoc> Turl: libv also maintains the debian part
<Turl> mnemoc: but is there a debian part? I don't think there's any packages on it :(
<Turl> anyway, I need to leave now, I'll be back in an hour or so
<lauri> I didn't find any debian packages there
<Turl> I can create the tags and fix makefiles a bit then
<lauri> that's why I created packages myself
<mnemoc> there is no "I" in communeaty
<lauri> :D
<lauri> I haven't separated source pacakges to dedicated folder (yet) but they're available here: http://packages.koodur.com/dists/jessie/main/binary-armhf/
<mnemoc> lauri: better talk with libv about helping with http://packages.linux-sunxi.org/
<lauri> yeah that's excatly what I am suggesting to get the packages to the right place :)
<lauri> I am just sharing what I did for fun :P
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<libv> lauri: you do know that libump and xf86-video-fbturbo are already packaged and just need to built for the respective debian distro, right?
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<libv> lauri: but the vdpau-sunxi stuff is new
<libv> the xorg.conf is pretty specific
<libv> and the chmodding should've been done by the respect package
<libv> respective package
<libv> i started this page to get some ideas/feedback on managing a bigger set of repositories, but the person who was interested in it 4 months ago bugger off: http://linux-sunxi.org/Packaging
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<lauri> libv: where can I find libump and fbturbo packages?
<libv> gotta love linus with respect to systemd/udev/whatever other flotsome this black hole gathered
<libv> lauri: packages.linux-sunxi.org
<libv> src is included
<libv> not sure whether the packaging made it back to ssvb yet
<libv> but libump is on sunxi github
<mru> hmm, gcc -lump
<mru> was that intentional?
<lauri> libv: I can't find the source package there, where is it exactly?
<lauri> libv: The binaries are missing so it did not change much for me ..
<libv> those will just as well build for debian
<lauri> Yeah I took the same source packages @ libump
<lauri> fbturbo aswell
<lauri> I mixed up :P
<lauri> I've got about 2G of packages here by now :S
<libv> while mate is outside our scope
<libv> the vdpau sunxi stuff is very interesting
<lauri> yeah libump is from your Ubuntu package
<lauri> fbturbo was cleanly packaged from git
<libv> we need to compare the diffs of debian/ then
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<lauri> 0.4.0 release and git diff in a separate patch
<lauri> at debian/patches/git-2014-01-14.diff
<lauri> let me know how I can help you guys
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