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<fiddlerwoaroof>
verisimilitude: the heuristics are part of the spec in HTML, though
<verisimilitude>
I wasn't aware of that. I find that disgusting.
<verisimilitude>
I appreciate it, fiddlerwoaroof.
<verisimilitude>
I was approaching it from the angle of HTML being XML's retarded descendent.
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<fiddlerwoaroof>
The standard does have a provision that says something like "on a parse error, a conforming parse error may signal an error" or something like that.
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<Duns_Scrotus>
i wonder if they wrote teh standard by disassembling IE6
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<verisimilitude>
Who knows, Duns_Scrotus, but we know they're just looking at Chrome for it, now.
<verisimilitude>
In any case, would I be correct in thinking no current Common Lisp HTML parser takes this approach and has customizable parse error behavior?
<Duns_Scrotus>
it's really an amazing piece of work
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<verisimilitude>
My idea was to have a simple parser that would ideally be fast and to only incur the complexity of heuristics if needed and optionally.
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<loke>
verisimilitude: Closure-HTML does a reasonable job most of the time.
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<ym>
M-. in last (quicklisp) slime/swank fails with "cond: Error: end of file on #<SB-IMPL::STRING-INPUT-STREAM {...}>"
<ym>
Just for me or anybody else has that appearance?
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<loke>
ym: works fuine for me.
<ym>
loke, slime-2.23?
<ym>
Hmm, seems like problem not in slime.
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<ym>
Updating SBCL doesn't solve issue.
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<fiddlerwoaroof>
I've generally found plump/lquery to be the easiest way to consume HTML
<emaczen>
fiddlerwoaroof: Have you worked on dynamically adding objc methods yet?
<fiddlerwoaroof>
you mean defining a class and adding methods? yeah
<emaczen>
fiddlerwoaroof: What exactly is the superclass parameter to objc_allocateClassPair ?
<emaczen>
the documentation is just confusing to me since it seems to say that it is the metaclass of the class you are creating, but then why name the parameter super_class?
<emaczen>
nvm, I read the incorrectly
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<beach>
Good morning everyone!
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<fiddlerwoaroof>
morning beach
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<no-defun-allowed>
do any CL implementations use cdr-coding these days?
<beach>
Nah.
<beach>
It would not be feasible without the hardware support of the Lisp machines.
<no-defun-allowed>
Fair enough.
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<LdBeth>
<no-defun-allowed "Fair enough."> #'no-defun-allowed: statistics showed CDR coding doesn’t reduce space used in practice
<no-defun-allowed>
That's very odd then. I read LispM compactors would try to create CDR coded lists.
<LdBeth>
If a list is supposed to be static, then it can be replaced by an array
<no-defun-allowed>
true
<LdBeth>
With CDR coding they cannot just copy the list, because the reference show be kept anyway, so after all fragmentation would be cause
<LdBeth>
But the idea of been able to control memory layout is great
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<splittist>
morn
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<LdBeth>
mornograph
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<shka_>
hello
<shka_>
phoe, beach: could it be that it provides R style data frames for the CL?
<shka_>
more specificly it supposed to be data frames and something akin to dplyr
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<phoe>
shka_: what are R style data frames?
<phoe>
oh, it's basically a relational table.
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<shka_>
phoe: not relational, but a table nonetheless
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<phoe>
OK - just a table then.
<phoe>
If it's a term already coined by R, then it sounds like naming it a data frame will be good enough.
<shka_>
phoe: issue is that there are other attempts at making cl data frame library
<shka_>
becaus summarise works only with built-in stuff and it is really annoying :P
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<shka_>
and i think i can do a lot better
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<beach>
LdBeth: What Common Lisp applications/libraries are you the creator/maintainer of?
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<LdBeth>
beach: I maintained a copy of CLFSWM, with a LispM Flavor package, I have privately kept a fork of CLWEB (I’ve send patches to the original author but seems he’s to busy to merge them), that’s all.
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<LdBeth>
And I don’t officially own/maintain any serious software
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<dim>
I prefer it when software is fun anyway ;-)
<LdBeth>
I’d like to learn how to use them for fun
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<beach>
LdBeth: Oh! :(
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<no-defun-allowed>
I've always found software very unfun.
<jackdaniel>
then work on something else, woodworks maybe
<no-defun-allowed>
It's not the software's fault, but when anyone else needs it, there's always a conflict and it ends in tears.
<LdBeth>
Isn’t TeX fun?
<no-defun-allowed>
jackdaniel: woodworking generally ends in tears and bloodshed quicker than programming, at least
<phoe>
LdBeth: it tends to be fun until you get an overfull hbox (badness 10000)
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<no-defun-allowed>
i always ignored those, since the paper never looked wrong
<no-defun-allowed>
oh, it's when the text can't be split onto multiple lines
<LdBeth>
phoe: that’s why people have to learn typologia and place line breaks by hand. Before an AI is made for working on this.
<no-defun-allowed>
though it's more fun than overfull buffer (badness [Segmentation fault, core dumped]
<LdBeth>
Algorithms simplified the processes, but didn’t eliminate them
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<akr>
hello, could anyone explain to me how to convert :t to t?
<akr>
this one doesn't work: (if (equal ssl :t) t ssl)
<jackdaniel>
akr: (or (eql ssl :t) ssl)
<jackdaniel>
but your code is correct too, you could elaborate on "doesn't work"
<akr>
I'm not sure what's going on with the variable ssl, if I format it with ~A, I get TT
<jackdaniel>
format it with ~S
<akr>
ok now I get :TT
<akr>
weird
<jackdaniel>
it seems you have put something like :tt (instead of :t)
<akr>
so this is using trivial-configuration-parser
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<akr>
and I have this line in the config: ssl = t;
<jackdaniel>
I don't know what a trivial-configuration-parser is, but there is no magic, ssl is bound to :tt
<akr>
yeah
<akr>
ok so for some reason the function is being executed twice
<akr>
ssl is actually :t
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<akr>
jackdaniel: thanks, I managed to figure it out in the end
<jimmyjoe>
why is one library of lisp called not secure
<beach>
Hello jimmyjoe
<jimmyjoe>
I think it's ironclad- it's not secure, why
<jimmyjoe>
hi beach
<akater>
jimmyjoe: Arguably, a dynamic language with rich runtime is not secure a priori.
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<jackdaniel>
jimmyjoe: I've heard this "advice" over and over again from people involved with security: never write crypto library because it is hard (imo it is a dumb advice)
<jimmyjoe>
what about other interpreters like python,ruby,etc - these libraries claim to be secure, and widely used.
<jimmyjoe>
I am not writing but using library
<jackdaniel>
but this attitude implies, that *any* crypto library written by a not enterprise is not secure (as if enterprise software were secure)
<jackdaniel>
by a human being*
<lieven>
jimmyjoe: secure as an absolute is fairly meaningless. you need to specify use case, attack model etc
<lieven>
jimmyjoe: some of the more hardened libraries try to achieve input independent code paths to prevent power consumption measurement attacks etc
<lieven>
jimmyjoe: in a lot of cases, that's not necessary
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<jackdaniel>
jimmyjoe: also, where did you find the claim, that ironclad is not secure?
<jackdaniel>
if you refere to a recent post by Wimpie Nortje it explicitly talks about threading issues
<jackdaniel>
what is kind of orthogonal to a software security (looking at its purpose)
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<jackdaniel>
s/a/this/
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<akater>
jimmyjoe: What I meant: If you want security, you generally do not want your program to enter a state not belonging to a (relatively) small set of specified, well-understood states.
<akater>
The idea of an interactive language with rich runtime goes against this. At the very least, the state space will tend to be as *large* as possible, contrary to what you'd want.
<akater>
Anyway, security is a topic that is *heavily* context-dependent, as lieven said.
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<White_Flame>
ruby etc call out to C libs to perform the crypto. they're not implemented in the interpreted langauge themselves
<White_Flame>
and as lieven mentioned, timing attacks and such are the primary concern with non-C written algos
<White_Flame>
those are written to ensure the same amount of CPU work happens regardless of path taken
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<akater>
Would you say it's a bad idea to assign meaning to objects dependening on whether certain slots are unbound?
<akater>
E.g., (obj :slot nil) means one thing while (obj :slot #<unbound>) means something else, and is also considered a proper object.
<White_Flame>
yes, use null or keywords or singleton flag objects for EQ comparison
<White_Flame>
s/null/nil/ ; too much hopping around languages
<jimmyjoe>
why power consumption is an attack, or monitoring timing?
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<jimmyjoe>
it's on the users pc , which is not monitored
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<White_Flame>
jimmyjoe: it is
<White_Flame>
and can be remotely
<jimmyjoe>
by whom?
<jimmyjoe>
it's not hacked
<White_Flame>
javascript, injected code, etc
<White_Flame>
even averaging out network response timings
<jimmyjoe>
js runs in the browser
<jackdaniel>
jimmyjoe: please note, that you drift slowly towards offtopic
<jackdaniel>
and there is #lispcafe for that
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<LdBeth>
GG
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<drmeister>
With Common Lisp CFFI - what is the idiomatic way to allocate an array of characters that I can pass a pointer to a function that will fill it with a zero terminated string. I know the maximum length of the zero-terminated string.
<pillton>
Xach: Is there something outstanding with issue #1604 in quicklisp-projects?
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<fe[nl]ix>
phoe: pong
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<dim>
drmeister: I had a weird dream/idea the other day with CL and the .Net platform wherein someone would do the same as you did with LLVM and clasp, only targeting the .Net IR thingy this time, so that you could have basically CL#
<dim>
I'm not sure if I should thank you for that too, adding to CANDO and clasp, but well ;-)
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<dim>
(I also more interestingly showed CANDO to a bio drugs researcher in Germany)
<jackdaniel>
I think that some ABCL fork targetted .net CLR
<dim>
IBCL or something yeah, I think, based on IKVM which is a Java layer for the CLR, and ABCL, I believe
<dim>
uabcl apparently
<dim>
anyway, gn here
<dim>
I fixed a couple annoying bugs in pgloader, now is time to get some sleep
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<Xach>
pillton: without looking, most likely not
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