<tankf33der>
- VLAs within structures is not supported by the LLVM Clang compiler and thus an issue for those wanting to build the kernel outside of GCC, Clang only supports the C99-style VLAs.
<tankf33der>
========
<tankf33der>
hm
<tankf33der>
C99 VLA in clang
<Regenaxer>
The old dynamic array problem
<tankf33der>
but clang can compile
<beneroth>
aye. now they removed VLAs in Linux.
<Regenaxer>
ah
<Regenaxer>
They surrendered
<beneroth>
Linus himself judged them stupid practice. I don't know enough about kernel dev to comment on that, I guess it might be right for the kernel.
<Regenaxer>
Perhaps
<beneroth>
Some people on HN comment in faviour of VLAs, e.g. for matrix computation
<beneroth>
which would be the similar use case to ours.
<Regenaxer>
I just don't know what would be the best to use in pil32
<beneroth>
"Its unfortunate that C and C++ kept the mindset that automatically memory managed variables are stored on a SMALL stack, with the consequence of exceeding that small and unknown size being that your program crashes."
<beneroth>
this is probably the main background for VLA opponents, I'd guess
<beneroth>
good you moved to asm with pil64 :/
<Regenaxer>
indeed!
<Regenaxer>
I would love to abandon pil32 completely
<Regenaxer>
just keep mini (which still has the VLA problem)
<beneroth>
I can understand that... on the other side, running on C 32bit is such a big feat...
<beneroth>
though C 32bit compatibility is given with emu
<Regenaxer>
yes
<beneroth>
so maybe drop pil32 and make emu to the new pil32...
<Regenaxer>
I use emu currently for PilBox on 32 bit, works fine
<beneroth>
how does emu on ARM compare to emu on x86 ?
<Regenaxer>
pil32 is used sometimes for bootstrapping
<Regenaxer>
Hard to compare
<Regenaxer>
needs "same" hardware
<beneroth>
I mean performance-wise
<Regenaxer>
yes
<Regenaxer>
which CPUs are equivalent?
<beneroth>
point taken.
<Regenaxer>
But emu is slow anyway, so not so important
<Regenaxer>
Seeing people using PilBox on Arm32 I see no difference
<beneroth>
well there is slow and there is impractically slow
<Regenaxer>
bottleneck is Java anyway
<Regenaxer>
right
<beneroth>
nothing bad with being slow, just the limits should be known.
<Regenaxer>
tight loops are noticeable
<Regenaxer>
I tried normal Pil DB apps, and saw no difference
<Regenaxer>
in PilBox I mean
<Regenaxer>
tapping on the GUI, network etc
<Regenaxer>
I am more worried about the small stack size in emu
<Regenaxer>
it is a compile time constant
<beneroth>
ah, alternative to VLA ?
<beneroth>
how small?
<beneroth>
can't you turn it into an startup-constant ?
<beneroth>
e.g. take a fixed percent of available memory at VM startup
<Regenaxer>
"#define STACK (8 * 1024 * 1024)"
<beneroth>
ok
<Regenaxer>
I PilBox there is no command line option ;)
<beneroth>
yes, but emu is not only pilbox :P
<beneroth>
well, in theory.
<Regenaxer>
I expect emu to be no longer such necessary on 32 bits
<Regenaxer>
ie 32 bit devices disappear :)
<beneroth>
I'm not so sure about the speed of that development.
<Regenaxer>
But emu is also good on unsupported CPUs
<beneroth>
T
<Regenaxer>
There are almost no 32 bit Android devices sold any more
<Regenaxer>
Currently over 50% of running devices are 64 bits
<beneroth>
I've got an old asus eee 32bit with no use laying around
<Regenaxer>
Is it Android?
<beneroth>
maybe I could install android on it :D
<Regenaxer>
no eee-PC?
<beneroth>
PC
<Regenaxer>
not sure
<Regenaxer>
It is x86, right?
<Regenaxer>
So not supported by PilBox currently
<Regenaxer>
(just a matter of building binaries though)
<Regenaxer>
bin/picolisp, bin/ssl
<Regenaxer>
+ ext and ht
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<razzy>
i am happy when i can run my code everywhere. how efficiently it run is less important
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<razzy>
is it working?
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<tankf33der>
i've successfully integrated handshake to plio for client server mode over TCP