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<rqou> whelp, got zero code written today because i didn't realize that today would become "giant pile of social things" day
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<qu1j0t3> ouch
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<pie__> rqou, oh no social things D:
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<balrog> does anyone here have (ancient) xilinx foundation 1.4i?
<enriq> hi
<enriq> anyone using chisel?
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<rqou> heh chisel
<rqou> you would expect me to have used it, but nope :P
<qu1j0t3> enriq: I was interested in it. There's a fork called SpinalHDL that supposedly solves some problems with Chisel.
<jn__> i'd also expect people who want an answer to stay around, but nope
<jn__> oh
<qu1j0t3> enriq is still here :)
<jn__> i'm just bad at reading, sorry :)
<enriq> I'm here
<qu1j0t3> it looks like it's that time when we list all the High level HDLs
<qu1j0t3> happens about once a month
<jn__> enriq: i'm sure some folks in #riscv have used it
<enriq> looks like the correct approach
<enriq> chisel I mean
<qu1j0t3> enriq: read the SpinalHDL critique first ... there are many options in this space.
<enriq> I'll check SpinalHDL when I feel there are problems
<enriq> ok
<qu1j0t3> enriq: Chisel looks great when all you've seen is Chisel (like JavaScript, lol)
<enriq> I'm a scala developer so I like that :)
<qu1j0t3> enriq: I wouldn't wait until you feel there are problems, I'd do some upfront research and comparisons. there are many tools
<qu1j0t3> so am I, but that doesn't mean chisel is the best option.
<enriq> quijote?
<qu1j0t3> yeah, i have many broken lances
<enriq> ok I'm checking now
<enriq> haha
<rqou> i'm pretty sure that (as is typical for UCB software) chisel is designed only for a very specific mindset/coding style
<qu1j0t3> yeah, and they are often kicked off by disillusioned people ... like frameworks
<enriq> ok chisel sucks
<qu1j0t3> LOL
<qu1j0t3> that was ... fast.
<enriq> I'm old :)
<enriq> what is clear from critics is that chisel is academic and Spinal is real life
<qu1j0t3> eh i don't see 'academic' as any kind of problem or turnoff.
<enriq> you're right
<enriq> I mean it's like haskell vs scala
<qu1j0t3> i think the only way to evaluate these things is to take them for a spin
<qu1j0t3> trying just one is the problem.
<enriq> ok so I abandon my chisel tutorial and go to Spinal
<qu1j0t3> these aren't the only ones either... there are dozens more.
<qu1j0t3> but if you're attached to Scala...
<enriq> I trust you blindly
<enriq> haha
<qu1j0t3> a terrible idea enriq :)
<balrog> I guess no one has old xilinx tools
<qu1j0t3> i'm saying trust nobody, do your own evaluations
<qu1j0t3> balrog: they used to have fairly old ones for download, not so now?
<enriq> I'd rather follow Sancho Panza but he's not around
<balrog> qu1j0t3: I'm looking for pre-ISE
<qu1j0t3> enriq: Maybe you are he
<balrog> XABEL-CPLD and Foundation
<rqou> balrog: what are you trying to do?
<rqou> if you _really_ want, i can try poking my father to check for old floppies
<balrog> rqou: figure out just how capable the JED2ABEL tool they included was
<enriq> I also would like to have just the command line tools of xilinx
<rqou> you can use modern ISE from the command line
<rqou> it's incredibly complicated though
<balrog> to decompile JEDs?
<balrog> or you're not tlaking to me?
<rqou> no, to just do normal synthesis (reply to enriq)
<balrog> talking*
<balrog> ah okay
<balrog> sorry
<enriq> why you need the old tools? (I'm just ignorant of everything, so just a curious question)
<enriq> because support of some devices?
<balrog> enriq: they included a JED decompiler with some specific old tools
<balrog> and I'm playing with a device that uses several of those chips
<enriq> decompile to what?
<balrog> that may be supported
<balrog> to equations
<azonenberg> You can use Vivado fro mthe command line too
<enriq> I would like that too
<rqou> balrog: xc5000? :P
<enriq> I mean decompile
<azonenberg> but that's even more of a pain in the neck and you have to write lots of tcl
<enriq> as my plan is to compile by hand
<balrog> rqou: xc9536. which I'm not sure is supported
<balrog> rqou: https://www.xilinx.com/support/answers/981.html is sufficiently ambiguous :)
<balrog> (Solution Step 2)
<rqou> hmm "Please note that there is a select list of simple PAL/PLD type devices that can be converted. This does not apply to CPLDs such as the 9500 and XPLA devices." implies it only worked on 22V10s or whatever
<enriq> qu1j0t3 I'm doing only 1 effort to learn some HDL and I like scala. The best shot is Spinal?
<balrog> rqou: yeah, as I said ambiguous
<rqou> just go an RE the 9500 already, it can't be that hard :P
<rqou> yeah, the way i read the AR it's definitely for 22V10s
<rqou> to convert them to something that can work on a newer CPLD
<felix_> rqou: you got the 34c3 voucher code i sent you?
<rqou> i did, but somehow it hasn't regenerated yet??
<felix_> they are regenerated once a day for the tickets where the payment is received; might take some time
<rqou> alright, i'm going to be getting a second ticket for my sister though
<felix_> is there anyone who is active in this project who wants to attend 34c3? if there is maybe give them the voucher first?
<azonenberg> I won't be able to make CCC due to other obligations, sadly
<azonenberg> Will be speaking at hardwear.io if anyone is going there
<azonenberg> and hopefully presenting follow-up work at REcon 2018
<rqou> oh btw balrog: the xc9500 and xc9500xl are pretty different in case you have both types of parts
<balrog> rqou: these are non-xl
<balrog> out of early-00s equipment
<balrog> xc9536 primarily
<rqou> i'm surprised the lock bits aren't set
<balrog> I'm not, the manufacturer was known to leave them unset
<balrog> they also placed JTAG ports and a motorola BDM port in very convenient locations
<rqou> is this a synth or an arcade board?
<balrog> syn th
<balrog> synth*
<balrog> so I was able to connect an old multilinx usb box to the jtag ports and dump them
<balrog> slooooowly
<rqou> ah that makes more sense
<balrog> (yeah, multilinx sucks)
<balrog> (but hey, it was free)
<balrog> a known issue with this synth is that you can plug an expansion ROM board in backwards
<balrog> if you do, it will erase the bootrom