rellla changed the topic of #linux-sunxi to: Allwinner/sunxi /development discussion - did you try looking at our wiki? - Don't ask to ask. Just ask and wait! - - Logs at - *only registered users can talk*
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<Mangy_Dog> MoeIcenowy hi again.... Do you know if its possible to get a stereo line out of the BananaPiZero? Ive noticed theres a single PCM and a SPDIF, but theres also a PCM in, can that be flipped to be a output too?
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<wens> the codec's analog output is not hooked up to anything. You'll need an external codec and hook it up via PCM/I2S or SPDIF
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<OnkelUlla> 17:07 < paulk-leonov> I want to do fastboot to avoid unplugging/plugging the microsd each time I try a new kernel
<Mangy_Dog> wens sorry a little confused there.... the PCM pin isnt a straight analogue out pin?
<OnkelUlla> paulk-leonov: Unfortunately it is not ready up to now, Chris is still working a redesign.
<paulk-leonov> OnkelUlla, thanks, I really like the idea!
<paulk-leonov> nice to see that pengu is working on one
<paulk-leonov> IIRC tizen folks also came up with something close for CI testing
<OnkelUlla> Yes, such a thing is really really helpful.
<paulk-leonov> either way, I figured that my tree was one year old for some reason, I'll retry getting usb peripheral working in u-boot with the latest tree
<paulk-leonov> since the commits where from early march, I thought it was fine... only that it was march 2018
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<wens> Mangy_Dog: no. It's a PCM/I2S interface
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<mru> I need to use the hdmi output on A20 with a different i2c controller for ddc
<mru> the driver doesn't currently support this
<mru> some display drivers (imx, mediatek) support a "ddc-i2c-bus" dt property
<mru> this property is also documented for the hdmi connector node itself
<mru> but nothing seems to actually look at this
<mru> mripard: what would you guys rather have me add to the sun4i-drm driver?
<mru> (and how to even find the connector node is something of a mystery)
<Mangy_Dog> wens so i have to use an external audio decoder to get sound? :/ why didnt they just fit some audio out on this board.... im starting to regret getting it...
<Mangy_Dog> it wouldnt have been hard to at least fit some unpopulated headers or solder pads or something at the very least....
<Mangy_Dog> if the pins are on the soc... why not at least break them out
<mru> some combination of cost and space
<mru> always check that a board has the i/o you required before buying
<mru> it's almost impossible to break out every pin on the soc
<mru> I'm not even sure it is possible
<mru> or it might require an 8-layer pcb with blind vias or something
<mru> which adds cost
<willmore> I think we need to make a list of boards sorted by "how fast you regret purchasing them". I'd put the Orange Pi PC way off to the 'never regret' side of the list.
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<Mangy_Dog> Well tbh i hate that they say Rasberry Pi Compatable GPIO... when it isnt..
<Mangy_Dog> but to skimp out on a audio out is just a big wtf
<mru> an onboard DAC would easily add $10 or more to retail price
<Mangy_Dog> but you wouldnt need a dac.... if you broke out the analogue audio pins of the soc
<mru> does it have such?
<Mangy_Dog> the h2+ does yes
<Mangy_Dog> at least the datasheets say it has
<willmore> Mangy_Dog, the Rpi boards aren't even Rpi compatable, so...
<KotCzarny> +1 for 'no-regrets' for opipc
<Mangy_Dog> the first big gripe for the banana pi zero for me was that when advatising Rpi GPIO compatable... it cant do DPI out... when thats a pretty big thing to have for embedded applications.
<Mangy_Dog> but i can live with it and just have to be fancy with low profile hdmi to ribbon and use a hdmi decoder chip
<willmore> DPI?
<Mangy_Dog> but then having to sort out audio seperately as well... thats just getting tedious
<willmore> Is that the video out port they use?
<Mangy_Dog> Rpi call it parralell display interface... but its basically digital paralell interface... running RGB lcds directly.
<Mangy_Dog> its a video out but not the DSI port i think your refering to
<willmore> That's not 'GPIO' in the least, so I wouldn't have expected a board that claimed to have Rpi GPIO to also have the display out connector.
<Mangy_Dog> it is gpio....
<willmore> I am not familiar with it.
<Mangy_Dog> your essentially bitbanging the display
<Mangy_Dog> youre
<willmore> Oh, how could that go wrong. :)
<Mangy_Dog> but on rpi its directly wired to the graphics chip
<Mangy_Dog> willmore
<willmore> Some allwinner chips have parallel LCD ports.
<Mangy_Dog> it doesnt go wrong
<Mangy_Dog> thats just it
<karlp> dude no.
<karlp> it's not bitbanging rgb.
<karlp> stahp
<Mangy_Dog> i come from arduino... where thats how its done...
<Mangy_Dog> so im sorry if the terminoligy is being a bit lost there
<karlp> there's some bitbaning vga around.
<Mangy_Dog> but the basic thing is... Its a really simplistic way of updating the screen
<karlp> that's not the same thing.
<Mangy_Dog> but in any case... its done through gpio... all teh Rpis models can do it... So when you sell a device that says its RPi compatable GPIO.... it really isnt
<KotCzarny> how many gpios you need?
<Mangy_Dog> depends on the rgb method
<karlp> no, you're reading farrrrr to much into rpi compatible gpio.
<Mangy_Dog> 888 takes up 8 pins per colour + h and v sync, clk and one or two other pots cant remember off the top of my head
<karlp> buy a rpi if you want an rpi
<Mangy_Dog> sighs
<Mangy_Dog> i brought the bnanana pi zero for the small form factor... and the higher speed chip
<Mangy_Dog> higher speed soc
<Mangy_Dog> than the Rpi zero
<Mangy_Dog> if they did a rpi zero with a quadcore 1.2 or 1.4ghz soc i would have gone with that for my project
<Mangy_Dog> im not crappign on anyone or even trying to big up Rpi....
<Mangy_Dog> im just a bit disapointed
<karlp> so, what are your actual requirements?
<Mangy_Dog> and not a fan of bad advatising or even worse documentation
<KotCzarny> for me it looks like you should just compare available interfaces and fix whatever differences there are
<mru> not checking the spec sheet against your requirements is a sure path to disappointment
<Mangy_Dog> but i did check
<Mangy_Dog> well
<Mangy_Dog> i checked the DPI thing after
<karlp> so... you didn't check.
<Mangy_Dog> because i assumed... When they say Rpi compatable GPIO... that it would be Rpi compatable...
<karlp> dude, let go of that.
<karlp> that was just wrong fomr the beginning.
<mru> parallel lcd != gpio
<karlp> so start where you are now.
<karlp> what do you want to do, what do you have.
<Mangy_Dog> mru yes it is
<mru> although many chips allow using those pins as gpio as well
<Mangy_Dog> it is gpio
<mru> nope
<Mangy_Dog> thats the thing
<Mangy_Dog> it runs over gpio
<mru> nope
* karlp leaves, waste of time.
<Mangy_Dog> its part of teh function of gpio
<mru> it's digital i/o, yes
<mru> you know, I could agree with you
<mru> but then we'd both be wrong
<karlp> "it's a signal, on a pin. gpio dude."
<KotCzarny> from wiki: General Purpose Input/Output (GPIO) is a generic pin on a integrated circuit chip whose behavior (including whether it is an input or output pin) can be controlled / programmed by the user at run time
<KotCzarny> i think trick here is 'g'
<Mangy_Dog> yes but if your advatising the interface to be the same as a rpi... when it isnt....
<Mangy_Dog> thats called false advatising
<mru> gpio means there's no specific functional block connected to the pins
<mru> including not an lcd driver
<KotCzarny> as for false advertising, welcome to the chinese world of wonderful trades
<karlp> drop the fucking false advertising ranting, you were wrong on that, you read wayyyyyyy to much into that. just let it go, you're only going to be sad
<Mangy_Dog> Kot thats my point
<Mangy_Dog> i agree
<KotCzarny> but i guess it includes western too
<Mangy_Dog> and its really fucking annoying
<KotCzarny> because rpi fundation lies a lot too
<Mangy_Dog> Kot actually no in this case no...
<mru> Mangy_Dog: no, _you_ are really fucking annoying
<karlp> you can't expect every function of every pin to be identicaly. you can get the gpios, sure, but not ht erest.
<KotCzarny> so just go with whatever work needs to be done
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<Mangy_Dog> if you say youor interface is compatable with, and it turns out it isnt... that leaves you open to being sued in the western world
* mru blames "maker" "culture"
<karlp> no, it really doesn't open you iup to be ing sued.
<karlp> go find a lawyer to take that case.
<karlp> pick a jurisdicion even.
<Mangy_Dog> in the western world it does... you sell a product that doesnt match what you claim it to be....
<karlp> what are you, 12?
<mru> most 12-year-olds are smarter than that
<Mangy_Dog> there are about a million and one laws against that in each country of the EU alone... then in america where the sue culture is much higher
<mru> you failed to read the spec sheet
<mru> get over it
<mru> you lost, what, $40?
<Mangy_Dog> not even that, but thats not the point
* mru looks over at pile of boards from failed evaluations
<Mangy_Dog> at the first point of sale... if you are being told it can do something when it cant...
<mru> but you weren't
<Mangy_Dog> yes i was
<Mangy_Dog> thats jut it
<Mangy_Dog> the fucking site even says it
<mru> no, you _thought_ you were
<mru> there's no law against you misunderstanding things
<mru> but I'm starting to wish there were
* karlp hi5s mru
<Mangy_Dog> they claim its a port that does the same thing as rpi ports.... when it doesnt....
<mru> show us
<Mangy_Dog> why is that such a hard concept to understand?
<Mangy_Dog> great i cant even find it on there ali page
<Mangy_Dog> the zero i mean
<mru> so let me get this straight...
<mru> you _thought_ you saw something written on their page
<mru> then you _misunderstood_ it
<Mangy_Dog> well right now i cant even find the shop page for the banana pi zero
<Mangy_Dog> m2 zero
<Mangy_Dog> not the same board but a h2+ and h3 soc
<Mangy_Dog> share the same datasheet
<Mangy_Dog> and even there
<Mangy_Dog> the GPIO compatible with Raspberry Pi B+ and can support raspbian Image
<KotCzarny> gpio in this case is probably 40pin header
<KotCzarny> not any camera/panel port
<mru> right, meaning the ground/power pins are in the same place
<mru> the exact functions available on the others almost certainly differ
<Mangy_Dog> what kot just said
<karlp> so you got gpios that are compatible. as described.
<Mangy_Dog> but theyre not
<karlp> the gpios are.
<Mangy_Dog> no they are not
<karlp> just not all the alternate mappings of pin functions
<Mangy_Dog> they dont have the same functions or alt functions
<karlp> which are not gpios
<Mangy_Dog> they might have some of the same basic functions and same attached hardware i2c spi ect. but they are not the same... they dont do the same things
<Mangy_Dog> so they are not the same. they are not compatable
<Mangy_Dog> its like trying to tell me that a grape fruit is an orange.
<mru> that page even lists all the functions for each pin
<Mangy_Dog> because they are both citrusy
<mru> I don't see LCD panel mentioned anywhere
<Mangy_Dog> mru nore does the Rpi... you have to delve deeper
<mru> you're the equivalent of someone complaining that his new Ford doesn't fly because airplanes are also a type of vehicle
<Mangy_Dog> no im not
<Mangy_Dog> it clearly says its compatable with a Rpi
<Mangy_Dog> but it isnt
<mru> do you see the table titled "40 PIN GPIO of Banana pi BPI-M2+"?
<mru> about halfway down the page
<Mangy_Dog> if anything you have it backward... its as if they advatised it can fly because they are both types of vehicles
<Mangy_Dog> yes i see it
<mru> good
<Mangy_Dog> i also see the paragraph that clearly says its Raspberry pi compatable
<mru> now where does that table say parallel lcd?
<Mangy_Dog> guess what?
<mru> "compatible" obviously means the power pins are in the same places
<Mangy_Dog> It doesnt say it on the front page of the raspberry pi shop page either
<Mangy_Dog> since fucking when
* karlp laughs
<Mangy_Dog> you know what
<Mangy_Dog> I have a USB plug
<Mangy_Dog> it must be raspberry pi gpio compatable because it has a GND and A 5v on it
<Mangy_Dog> clearly those are the same
<Mangy_Dog> so its compatable... yeah
<Mangy_Dog> thats right
<KotCzarny> you should just bit the bullet that you didnt compare ACTUAL interfaces, just read the marketing description
<Mangy_Dog> Kot i agree i should have read the data sheet more througherly
<KotCzarny> any engineer believing marketing should be fired
<KotCzarny> immediately
<Mangy_Dog> and i can still make this work
<Mangy_Dog> but its a pain
<KotCzarny> yes, it's real world vs marketing
<KotCzarny> and lets not start with banana pis documentation having copypaste bugs
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<Mangy_Dog> and its not liek im using this in a product its a personal project... and also poorly documented stuff too... its only by googling i found the sunxi wiki for the SOC documentation... but thats only for SOC not the boards themselves.
<Mangy_Dog> and sure i was stupid for taking some assumptions....
<mru> and the soc documentation is clear that it doesn't have a parallel lcd output
<Mangy_Dog> many of these single board computers market themselves as more powerful versions or alternatives to Pi that are nearly fully compatable with pi community... Now im not stupid enough to think the OS builds are going to just work... but yeah some of the marketing i used to skim read details... Like GPIO compatability
<Mangy_Dog> mru yes i know thank you
<Mangy_Dog> like i said i found that out after the purchase...
<mru> and you should've checked before buying
<KotCzarny> or just be prepared for failures, especially for extremely low cost products
<Mangy_Dog> prehaps... but they wernt so easily available to me at the time
<KotCzarny> i was lucky to find before buying my first sbc (i planned to get rpi)
<Mangy_Dog> Kot tbh if its DOA... ill be pretty pissed
<KotCzarny> got the opipc and never looked back
<Mangy_Dog> i would hope theres at least a "does it turn on" QA test
<KotCzarny> now there is even more to choose from
<Mangy_Dog> oh and i got a orange pi zero too
<Mangy_Dog> its a tad larger though
<Mangy_Dog> even has DSI
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<Mangy_Dog> but im not sure if its able to do direct LVDS driving like the PI DSI seems to be able to do
<mripard> mru: if you have a use case for that, yeah, supporting ddc-i2c-bus property is the right way formward
<Mangy_Dog> personally wish it was possible to have a DSI port that can directly drive DPI... that would be fun... (yes i know wont happen)
<mru> mripard: yes, but on which node?
<mru> the hdmi controller or the connector?
<mripard> the DT hdmi connector however doesn't have a proper driver at the moment though, so the path of least resistance would be to have an ad-hoc parsing code in the HDMI driver
<mripard> on the connector
<wens> IIRC the GPIOs are partially compatible, in the sense that the official functions are supported
<mru> mripard: could you tell me how to find the connector node from the driver?
<mru> it is anything but obvious
<mru> and I can't find anything else doing it either
<wens> alternate functions aren't supported, duh
<mripard> mru: sure
<KotCzarny> well, mentions lvds
<Mangy_Dog> Going back to my original sound question........ i2c. Anyone know of a stereo version of that break out? Ideally something i can easily clone onto my pcb design?
<KotCzarny> does it mean it can drive lvds directly?
<KotCzarny> it uses A31s soc
<mripard> mru: you basically need to follow the HDMI graph link, and you can do so use of_graph_get_remote_node
<Mangy_Dog> tbh no idea.... and also tbh :D i was hoping to have to avoid lvds and dsi displays based on cost....
<Mangy_Dog> dpi displays are just a whole bunch cheaper and easier to get
<mru> mripard: which lands two levels down from the connector node
<KotCzarny> anyway, since im no expert, i will leave finding proper names for someone else
<Mangy_Dog> thanks though Kots
<wens> KotCzarny: M2 is not M2 Zero :)
<KotCzarny> wens, yeah, i know, that's why i mentioned soc
<KotCzarny> i cant find any page on wiki comparing/describing video interfaces tho
<wens> IIRC pretty much all the SoCs that support LCD support LVDS
<mripard> mru: what do you mean?
<mru> doesn't of_graph_get_remote_node return the "endpoint" node?
<wens> KotCzarny: the mainlining effort page is good enough. if it says N/A in the LVDS row, then the SoC doesn't support it
<mru> which is under a "port" node of the connector node
<KotCzarny> wens, he goes after DPI, how does that relate to rgb/lvds/etc ?
<wens> DPI == RGB in this context
<wens> P being parallel
<mripard> mru: no, that would be of_graph_get_remote_endpoint
<wens> Mangy_Dog: get a HiFi Berry or something
<mripard> _get_remote_node returns the parent device node
<mru> oh, too many similar names
<mru> thanks
<KotCzarny> wens: so, touch luck, because there is N/A for H3/H2+ for RGB
<KotCzarny> :>
<Mangy_Dog> wens i just really need something as simple as possible...
<Mangy_Dog> simple like the one i just posted... but in stereo :D
<KotCzarny> and H3/H2+ cant drive any panel directly. only via hdmi
<wens> personally I would've suggested the M2 Magic, which is small enough
<KotCzarny> (not considering spi/i2c for video)
<wens> or Olimex's A33-OLinuXino
<wens> you get DPI/LVDS and analog audio
<wens> ugh, I take that back
<Mangy_Dog> ?
<Mangy_Dog> i was about to say ive been looking at that board too
<Mangy_Dog> but take it back why?
<wens> M2-Magic doesn't have DPI
<Mangy_Dog> ah
<wens> A33-OLinuXino does though
<Mangy_Dog> pretty chunky though
<Mangy_Dog> tbh i think im going to stick with the banPizero
<Mangy_Dog> just have to figure this other stuff out
<Mangy_Dog> the hdmi decoder chip isnt too scary. pretty simple design and direct otu to rgb888
<Mangy_Dog> and ive ordered a bunch of low profile hdmi to ribbons
<Mangy_Dog> i want to run it to speakers but i could always just add a mini amp to that
<Mangy_Dog> and have the option of the ack
<Mangy_Dog> jack
<Mangy_Dog> but then the question is do i use the module or intergrate the ada design into my pcb
<Mangy_Dog> :D
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<Mangy_Dog> just read through the Ada data on the breakout.... One thing it doesnt mention is if the L and Rout pins are cutt off if a jack in plugged into the headphone socket... Or if those pins are just mirroring the jack socket pins.
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<mru> oh, it's probably compatible with the rpi
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<buZz> 'compatible' ?
<Mangy_Dog> mru get over yourself....
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<Mangy_Dog> dont worry buzz mru is being a prick
<mru> buZz: you missed the preceding discussion
<buZz> k k
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<Mangy_Dog> if it doesnt cut off the out pins, I guess it might be possible to have some kind of transistor on ground return of the jack. that detects when theres a signal and cuts off the speaker out lanes... but i dont know audio well enough. I cant help but think that will likely cause distortion
<fALSO> hi there
<mru> mripard: it's working, thanks
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<Mangy_Dog> one last quick question for now... The project im doing is a handheld gaming machine... My original plan want to do the controls through a teensy or stm32 acting as a standard HID. But with all the spare gpios now on this bananapi... seems foolish to do that. SO... is setting up controls over gpio pretty much the same as they are for r-pi?
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<plaes> Mangy_Dog:
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<megi> is it possible that ethernet problems on H6 with 2GB of ram are related to the size of RAM being > 1GB? I'm not sure how to test this hypothesis, though. Is it possible to limit size of RAM in u-boot?
<mru> what problems?
<mru> ram size seems unlikely, whatever it is though
<megi> it only half-works, it can communicate with phy, but no data get sent/received
<mru> what board is this?
<megi> Orange Pi 3
<BenG> H6 ethernet works for me with 1/2/4GB
<megi> BenG: thanks
<BenG> did you tune the delays?
<mru> the usual suspects would be pinmux, phy mode, and rx/tx skew
<megi> mru: what is phy mode?
<KotCzarny> you can always try adding mem=512M to cmdline
<mru> megi: rgmii and such
<megi> BenG: I did try the values that the working BSP kernel uses
<BenG> what PHY?
<BenG> 8211F?
<BenG> could be phy-mode still
<BenG> if there is a fixed delay enabled and you add the BSP values
<BenG> stuff will be off
<megi> RTL8211E Gigabit Ethernet stmmac-0:01: attached PHY driver [RTL8211E Gigabit Ethernet] (mii_bus:phy_addr=stmmac-0:01, irq=POLL)
<megi> hmm
<megi> what do you mean by "fixed delay enabled"?
<BenG> 8211 has fixed delay lines you can either enable by resistor or magic register values
<BenG> and you have the trimmable lines that you tune with the delay parameters
<BenG> depending on the board delays that gives you multiple ways to maybe get the timing right :)
<BenG> phy-mode = "rgmii"; phy-mode = "rgmii-id";
<BenG> etc...
<megi> interesting, I'll look at the schematic, and check the BSP phy driver... so far I only knew about the SoC side delays
<megi> thanks for the pointers
<BenG> I think that is sometimes the reason the delay values from BSP dont always fit for mainline
<BenG> I´m never 100% sure either
<BenG> if the board traces are even length/delay
<BenG> you theoertically only need to enable the fixed delays
<BenG> to get the right timing
<BenG> but in practice I think you usually require the delays as well
<megi> I guess I'll have to just try various combinations :)
<BenG> first check the schematic if there are delays enabled via the resistor config
<BenG> has a pretty nice summary of where you want to be ;)
<BenG> basically on each RX, the clock has to be 4ns later than data changing
<BenG> so that the data is sampled in a stable state
<megi> I have to check the datasheet for the phy, the relevant pins are pulled high, but there's no indication if that means enabled or not
<BenG> *2ns
<BenG> yeah
<BenG> they can also be enabled viah phy-mode
<BenG> if the driver supports it
<BenG> which the 8211 one does afaik
<megi> it looks like 2ns delay is enabled on both rx and tx
<megi> via those pins
<BenG> ok
<BenG> then in theory the BSP values should work I guess
<BenG> unless the phy driver turns them off again :)
<BenG> phy-mode = "rgmii-id";
<BenG> enables both delays via software
<mru> you could just check the signals with a scope
<megi> mru: measuring 2ns delays is out of my hobby tools range :)
<BenG> 250Mhz is not super fast, but still requires a capable scope
<mru> a worthwhile investment, imo
<BenG> and you have to get to the signals :)
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<mru> qfn package, easy
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<BenG> I mean you can get some reasonably old stuff like
<BenG> 9000 series LeCroy or sth
<megi> mru: I'll start with informed exhaustive search of all possible delay values, it's not like there are too many combinations :)
<BenG> tkaiser had a script for that
<BenG> ayufan extended it a bit with dts overlays
<BenG> so you dont have to reboot while going through them
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<mru> rgmii signals are only 125 MHz btw
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