<abdallah>
Is there anything I should have installed before running ocamlbrew?
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<abdallah>
I get "bng_amd64.c: Assembler messages:" errors when trying to use "opam switch 4.00.1" to get from 3.12.1 to something more recent
<abdallah>
I seem to get the same errors with "opam switch 4.01.0"
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<wwilly>
bonjour
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<companion_cube>
hi
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<pippijn>
hi
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<adrien_oww>
morning
<pippijn>
adrien_oww: I'm in paris :)
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<adrien_oww>
oh
<adrien_oww>
I hope you got your armor and everything else needed to defend yourself in the metro :P
<pippijn>
it wasn't that bad today in the morning
<pippijn>
we'll see how it goes in the evening
<adrien_oww>
you're already working?
<pippijn>
not working really
<pippijn>
doing organisational stuff
<adrien_oww>
well, commuting?
<pippijn>
I don't have an apartment yet
<pippijn>
I'm staying in a hostel in the 9eme
<companion_cube>
pippijn: were are you working? doing an internship?
<pippijn>
companion_cube: no, doing the C frontend for xavier rival's static analysis group
<companion_cube>
wish it was an ocaml frontent
<pippijn>
written in ocaml :)
<companion_cube>
yes but that's my point
<pippijn>
yes
<pippijn>
I understand
<companion_cube>
why are all the verification tools targeting bad languages?
<pippijn>
too little static analysis for ocaml
<companion_cube>
Xavier Leroy pointed that out recently
<adrien_oww>
because good langages don't need them much?
<companion_cube>
adrien_oww: come on, it's still useful
<pippijn>
there is a..
<pippijn>
ocaml to coq thing
<adrien_oww>
companion_cube: yeah but do you need to check that you're not doing a buffer overflow in ocaml?
<pippijn>
characteristic formula
<companion_cube>
adrien_oww: you could check that exceptions are handled
<companion_cube>
or that you don't compare functional values
<adrien_oww>
sure, but there's a tenth (if not less) of the need
<bernardofpc>
companion> why are all the verification tools targeting bad languages? -> because maybe those are the ones that need most, or else maybe the people out there pay the most for
<companion_cube>
yes, I know
<adrien_oww>
most C codes are bombs waiting to explode
<companion_cube>
but that would still be useful for Ocaml, and would require less work? :)
<bernardofpc>
not so sure
<companion_cube>
the polymorphic operators are a hole that can justify the use of static analysis, imho
<bernardofpc>
in C, you only have very basic types
<companion_cube>
also, for optimization
<bernardofpc>
whereas in OCaml you must provide all GADT intelligence further
<companion_cube>
well, that's kind of advanced usage ^^
<bernardofpc>
sure, but since you're asking to verify OCaml for potential mistakes, you have to find them where they might be :D
<companion_cube>
bernardofpc: as I said, the main dangers are 1/ uncaught exceptions 2/ polymorphic equal/compare/hash
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<bernardofpc>
why is 2 a danger, and why would one always wnat to try/catch ?
<companion_cube>
2/ will fail hard if applied to functions/closures
<bernardofpc>
how so ?
<companion_cube>
try/catch should trigger a warning
<companion_cube>
bernardofpc: you can't compare functions
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<bernardofpc>
ocamllex question: http://ocaml.xelpaste.net/8885 -> is there a sane way to convert that to using one more definition (let point = coord ',' coord) and still have a reasonable function converting the strings to integer coordinates ?
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<pippijn>
adrien_oww: do you know what such a letter from parents saying they pay if I can't pay rent should look like?
<companion_cube>
bernardofpc: I don't see a better way
<pippijn>
companion_cube: maybe you know :) you're also in france, right?
<companion_cube>
pippijn: it's called a "caution", but as for the content I'm not sure
<bernardofpc>
not sure that works if your parents are not French, though
<bernardofpc>
(sure that does not work if your parents are from Brazil)
<pippijn>
hmm
<companion_cube>
I mean the presentation, the content must be isomorphic to "we engage our responsibility to pay as much as n months of rent if our son fails to" or whatever
<pippijn>
they are from NL
<companion_cube>
:s
<pippijn>
and live in DE
<bernardofpc>
live in DE should be more important
<bernardofpc>
(where they pay their taxes / receive their money, I mean)
<pippijn>
right
<companion_cube>
that may be crazy, but maybe your embassy can be a kind of proxy for your parents?
<bernardofpc>
maybe someone from your job ?
<companion_cube>
since they're based in france, they would be more trustworthy, and would trust your parents more easily too
<pippijn>
I doubt someone from my job can do that
<pippijn>
or is willing to
<bernardofpc>
(I know many thesis advisors were "caution" for their students
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<pippijn>
companion_cube: I don't know what you mean, actually
<pippijn>
I go to the dutch embassy and..
<pippijn>
I don't know what I'm supposed to ask them to do for me
<companion_cube>
and you ask them to be "caution" for you, since you're dutch (you are, aren't you?)
<pippijn>
yes
<pippijn>
how can they do that?
<companion_cube>
by signing a paper?
<companion_cube>
:D
<pippijn>
they would do that?
<companion_cube>
maybe, I don;t know
<companion_cube>
if they can get to trust your parents on the other side
<pippijn>
hmm
<companion_cube>
that's just a wild guess, I must say
<bernardofpc>
can't your employer (the "company") help you there ?
<pippijn>
my employer is the one who said I should ask my parents for that letter
<companion_cube>
yes, that's the default, but if it's not enough you'll have to try something else
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<pippijn>
I'll try the parents letter first
<pippijn>
once I find out how to write one
<adrien_oww>
yup, "cautions" (french) can be more annoying when the people are abroad
<adrien_oww>
pippijn: embassy or "consulat"?
<pippijn>
consulate is just a proxy for the embassy, isn't it?
<adrien_oww>
it's the structure that's supposed to help you for administrative tasks
<companion_cube>
hmm, yes, maybe I was thinking of consulate actually
<adrien_oww>
at least for the ones in nl but I guess they can do it the other way too
<pippijn>
"It is common for landlords to ask for additional guarantees (guaranties), especially if you are not in full-time employment or your income is not more than 3 times higher then the rent. For students, this is usually a letter from your parents. If not, you may have to get a friend or your bank to guarantee that if you default, they will pay whatever is owned for the remainder of the contract."
<bernardofpc>
pippijn: you're staying long enough that your contract lasts longuer than the "préavis" ?
<pippijn>
I'm staying at least 12 months
<pippijn>
I don't know preavis
<companion_cube>
neat
<bernardofpc>
that should be fine then
<bernardofpc>
preavis is the time that you have to warn your landlord before you leave
<pippijn>
ah, 3 months
<bernardofpc>
usually that's 3 months for "empty" appartments, and 1 for furnished ones
<pippijn>
ok
<pippijn>
yeah
<pippijn>
I'm staying longer
<bernardofpc>
so the "remainder" is 3 months
<pippijn>
ah, then the 3 times higher makes sense
<bernardofpc>
yeah...
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<bernardofpc>
good luck in all that ;-)
<pippijn>
thanks
<pippijn>
it's strange that I can't find a template for such a cautions letter
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<companion_cube>
hcarty, gasche: is there a batteries irc chan?
<adrien_oww>
pippijn: "lettre de caution" ?
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<kerneis>
pippijn: there is a full page of legalese to handwrite when you sign the contract, and usually people guaranteeing your rent also need to write it down
<kerneis>
(at least when you go to an agency, no idea about renting directly from landlord)
<kerneis>
and you don't need anything formal before you secure the flat, just a few words saying they agree & a signature (+ a copy of their salary bill of course…)
<kerneis>
YMMV, do as they ask
<adrien_oww>
(but watch out for scams too)
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<kerneis>
(since the handwritten part at the end is mandatory, and contains the figure of the rent)
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<flux>
so what's the batteries way of reading file contents to a string? Of course File.with_in filename input_all would not work, because input_all uses Pervasives.in_channel..
<flux>
I think there is a way but I have forgotten and cannot find it :)
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<flux>
(I mean in addition to the more worksome alternatives)
<flux>
ah, it always helps, Pervasives.input_file
<flux>
(I'm not sure if the placement of all these is the most logical..)
<companion_cube>
or File.with_file_in foobar Text.read_all;; if you like utf-8
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<flux>
hmm
<flux>
I thought I tried that, but apparently not
<flux>
thanks :)
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<pippijn>
kerneis: thanks
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<hcarty>
companion_cube: I don't think so - just here
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<hcarty>
avsm: Is Lwt HTTPS server support planned for Cohttp?
<hcarty>
flux: There is a BatPervasives.input_file function which slurps in an entire file at once.
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<hcarty>
flux: And it probably does make sense to have that function and write_file in BatFile.
<avsm>
hcarty: yeah, although patches before are welcome. see the HTTP_CLIENT ticket for thoughts on how it should work
<avsm>
(i'd like an alternative one which spins up an stunnel process and satisfies the same interface)
<hcarty>
avsm: I doubt I'll be able to contribute beyond testing whatever implementation(s) are available, but if that changes I'll be sure to send a pull request
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<hcarty>
I'm working on getting several packages ready for opam. One of them is a binding to a C library which can be linked against a number of supporting libraries (different JPEG 2000 implementations).
<hcarty>
Debian/Ubuntu configure their package with one JPEG library, Fedora/EPEL use another, and building by hand provides a third option
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<hcarty>
How should something like this be handled in an opam-friendly way? There are already configuration flags in the library's _oasis file - I want to make sure I expose those in a flexible and useful way in the opam metadata.
<hcarty>
For example, on Debian you might need '--enable-jasper --enable-jpeg --enable-png' while a custom build of the underlying C library may require '--enable-openjpeg --enable-jasper --enable-png'
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<Drup>
hcarty: I would say multiple conf-* packages
<Drup>
not very satisfactory, but it would do the job
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<hcarty>
Drup: That's the best I've been able to come up with too.
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<companion_cube>
gasche: the tutorial by avsm explains it, I think
<companion_cube>
basically, go to settings
<companion_cube>
then "service hooks"
<companion_cube>
then you'll need to enable travis
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<gasche>
companion_cube: I don't have a travis login (and it seems painful to get one)
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<companion_cube>
can't you "login from github"?
<gasche>
nobody in his or her right mind would click "I accept" given the listing of granted rights
<companion_cube>
hmmm
<gasche>
I know this is a well-known github problem that people just ignore, but these things bore me to death and I just don't want to have to *think* about that
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<gasche>
I gave you enough rights to proceed, hopefully
<gasche>
(more than yesterday, that means)
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<companion_cube>
gasche: well, you're right in that, the permission list is worrying
<bernardofpc>
You shall defend and indemnify GitHub -> bouh
<companion_cube>
what does it even mean? ...
<gasche>
(going away)
<bernardofpc>
if X wants money from your source code claiming copyright , and GH has to pay, then you pay GH back
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<companion_cube>
huh
<companion_cube>
but how coudl github be forced to pay, since they're not the infringer?
<adrien_oww>
east texas is wondeful
<bernardofpc>
because they publish ?
<bernardofpc>
well, the best thing to do is read the tosdr above
<bernardofpc>
(which is unvaluable service)
<companion_cube>
yeah
<companion_cube>
pfff
<bernardofpc>
something like that, yeah
<NoNNaN>
wow, interesting service
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<adrien_oww>
I'm not a huge fan of tosdr
<adrien_oww>
most licenses leave things to intepretation and tosdr strips that out
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<adrien_oww>
one good example was that the GPL was said to prevent commercial uses
<adrien_oww>
that has been fixed but the author changed it reluctantly
<adrien_oww>
so tosdr has no warrenty :)
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<NoNNaN>
well, in most country the law interpretation is court privilege, so not even your lawyer interpretation comes with no warranty
<adrien_oww>
yeah :)
<adrien_oww>
but I have some doubts that what you get on the website is impartial in practice :)
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<NoNNaN>
well, every single character is important in a contact, there was a court case when a misplaced comma cost ~1 million canadian dollar (Rogers Communications vs Bell Aliant)
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<companion_cube>
is there a way to remove fat from ocaml's library files?
<adrien>
hahahahaha
<adrien>
good night :]
<companion_cube>
good night adrien :p
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