ChanServ changed the topic of #ocaml to: Discussions about the OCaml programming language | http://caml.inria.fr/ | http://www.ocaml.org | OCaml 4.01.0 announce at http://bit.ly/1851A3R | Logs at http://irclog.whitequark.org/ocaml
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<whitequark> Drup: why does eliom have a set of its own compiler wrappers and such?
<whitequark> what, ocamlfind not good enough for you?
<whitequark> oh, I see it, looking at the source
<whitequark> js_of_ocaml: Error: Instr.Bad_instruction(159)
<whitequark> sigh
<Drup> what have you done again ? x)
<whitequark> I have no clue
<Drup> use the wrappers and jpdeplaix's ocamlbuild plugin, be a good boy for once :D
<whitequark> Drup: I used eliom-distillery
<Drup> that's ok too
<whitequark> but it doesn't build
<Drup> did they change bytecode format ?
<Drup> in 4.02
<whitequark> there's some change in Oct 2013
<whitequark> so it seems: yes
<Drup> so js_of_ocaml need a fix, are you using the released version or the dev one ?
<whitequark> released
<Drup> let's see
<whitequark> I think it's this
<whitequark> right. notrace
<whitequark> js_of_ocaml doesn't appear to have any 4.02 branches
<whitequark> that being said, why doesn't it detect magic?
<Drup> it does
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<whitequark> why does it try to misread the format then?
<Drup> because the patch for 4.02 was done some time ago, maybe something else changed since
<Drup> bug report
<Drup> :)
<Drup> http://ocsigen.github.io/js_of_ocaml/#4.02.0dev+trunk this work, at least
<whitequark> hmm
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<Drup> whitequark: do you know a way to make oasis print the ocamlbuild invocation used ?
<whitequark> oh
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<dmbaturin> Why the js_of_ocaml readme says bytecode provides a stable API? Some time ago someone here said bytecode is version-specific.
<whitequark> make all BUILDFLAGS=-info
<Drup> dmbaturin: the changes are far more important than the syntax
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<Drup> whitequark: doesn't work
<whitequark> ocaml setup.ml -build -info
<whitequark> -info -build, rather
<whitequark> that works for me
<Drup> nice, thanks
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<Drup> hhugo: are you still in europe ? =')
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<MercurialAlchemi> Hi folks
<MercurialAlchemi> What's the best way of moving (or copying-and-deleting) a file?
<MercurialAlchemi> I'm using Core, if that helps
<MercurialAlchemi> This needs to work between two different volumes
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<MercurialAlchemi> I see that opam falls back on cp
<MercurialAlchemi> ugggh
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<whitequark> Drup: ping
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<Drup> ?
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<Drup> whitequark: pong
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<whitequark> Drup: nevermind
<whitequark> I was looking for eliom tutorials
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<anddam> which of the books suggested on the website should someone knowlegeable in programming but with only a very light knowledge of FP start with?
<anddam> beware of the broken English
<eikke__> anyone living in Paris by accident?
<eikke__> (I know, off-topic... but got some questoins and this might be a community where someone could help me out :) )
<adrien> no ocaml programmer is french
<reventlov> plenty
<adrien> anddam: the usual advice is RWO
<reventlov> adrien: implying france is paris
<reventlov> eikke__: you may want to look at http://www.meetup.com/ocaml-paris/ too.
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<rks`> reventlov: implying he didnt mean "Paris, TX"
<eikke__> reventlov: maybe once I live there ;-)
<eikke__> I might take a job over there, but should figure out living costs (rent etc)
<rks`> eikke__: where are you from?
<eikke__> Belgium
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<rks`> ok, the answer is: expensive
<eikke__> I know :-) that's why I need to figure this out carefully before accepting any offer
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<jerith> I'm looking at some code I wrote last month.
<jerith> It's so horrible.
<jerith> I guess that means my OCaml has improved quite a lot since then.
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<ygrek> jerith, or maybe you just write horrible code
<whitequark> cruel
<ygrek> l0g1c
<jerith> ygrek: I usually don't notice that my code is horrible.
<jerith> (Except when it's horrible for reasons I can't escape.)
<ygrek> inattentiveness - tick ^_^
* jerith grins.
<jerith> I was just starting to learn OCaml when I wrote this code. Now that I kind of know what I'm doing I can see all the beginner mistakes I made.
<jerith> So I'm replacing them with more advanced beginner mistakes. ;-)
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<jerith> Should I be using atdgen for JSON serialisation?
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<whitequark> atdgen is great, if a bit quirky
<whitequark> or you could wait for JSON support in ppx_deriving ;p
<jerith> How do I get stack traces from my errors?
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<jerith> whitequark: Tempting, but I'm only off work for two more days and I want to have a prototype of this thing finished before I go back.
<whitequark> jerith: aww shoot. I'm busy for exactly two days
<whitequark> atdgen it is, then
<whitequark> stacktraces; export OCAMLRUNPARAM=b
<jerith> I may switch to ppx_deriving at some point in the future, though.
<whitequark> I will be more motivated to implement it if you open an inssue
<jerith> Wonderful, thank you.
<jerith> whitequark: Does ppx_deriving require 4.02?
<whitequark> unfortunately, yes
<jerith> Then I'm not really keen to depend on it until it's been released for a while.
<whitequark> it should be released soon
<jerith> I don't mind depending on cutteing-edge libraries, but I prefer to support at least the last two versions of the language I'm using.
<whitequark> then you're out for at least a year
<jerith> Yeah. :-/
<jerith> There's nothing to stop me playing with it before then, but there's a (very tiny) chance that this code might actually be used in production at some point.
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<anddam> adrien: RWO: nothing appropriate
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<adrien> anddam: real work ocaml
<adrien> ?
<anddam> no
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<anddam> adrien: I mean if you asking if I'm interested in ocaml for actual work then the answer is no, I'm reading about it out of curiosity
<anddam> btw I'm halfway my LISP book, I'd like to finish it before reading more about ocaml. Does knowing LISP help with ML?
<flux> I think not greatly
<flux> perhaps a bit, if the alternative is knowing nothing or knowing only imperative languages
<adrien> argh
<adrien> real _world_ ocaml
<adrien> sorry
<adrien> but that's just the name of the book
<anddam> flux: the alternative is just imperative paradigm
<anddam> LISP is so… weird so far
<anddam> not bad, tho'
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<anddam> adrien: I still don't get "adrien | anddam: the usual advice is RWO"
<anddam> the candidate seems to be "OCaml from the Very Beginning"
<jerith> anddam: Real World OCaml is a pretty good book.
<anddam> oh that was a title
<jerith> It's what I learned from.
<anddam> the o'really one
<anddam> I see
<jerith> I think I'll actually just do this JSON stuff by hand with yojson.
<jerith> atdgen's error messages are too unhelpful.
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<whitequark> Drup: so my perfect end goal for pry.ml is like https://github.com/charliesome/better_errors
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<spacebat> I've just installed the dns package via opam
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<spacebat> I'm new to this though - where did it install to? I can see definitions for different versions of the package under ~/.opam
<spacebat> but no *dns*.ml
<spacebat> the docs for the package say to look at the examples, but so far I can't find where they are
<octachron> Assuming you are using your system compiler, look at .opam/system
<Kakadu> very likely examples were not isntalled
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<spacebat> I installed opam with ocamlbrew
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<spacebat> no directory called system anywhere under ~/.opam
<octachron> Ah... Do you have a 4.0* directory? But even so I fear that Kakadu is right and the example were not installed
<spacebat> I'm fine with looking up the examples on github
<Kakadu> spacebat: you probably need to reinstall package with -v -b options, go to the build directory and try to build examples there
<spacebat> right now I just feel like I don't know what's going on :)
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<spacebat> there is a ~/.opam/4.01.0
<spacebat> but no dns anything under there
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<spacebat> where does opam put the packages? - like the build directory - I don't know where that is
<spacebat> ah ~/.opam/4.01.0/build
<Kakadu> by default build files are removed after installation
<spacebat> oh ok
<Kakadu> opam's `-b' switch will rescue you
<spacebat> so the resulting files go in the lib dir?
<Kakadu> some where. What `ocamfind list | grep -i dns' says?
<spacebat> opam install dns -v -b
<spacebat> just sits there a moment and finishes with no output
<Kakadu> it seems that ocamlfind's package name is not so obvious
<Kakadu> anyway, with -v switch you can get full log what have happenned
<spacebat> ocamlfind list | grep -i dns
<spacebat> gives no output
<spacebat> but without the grep I can see a long list of packages
<Kakadu> Yeah, long list is normal
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<spacebat> looking for what the package might be called, if bizarrely not anything with dns in the name
<spacebat> could it be called lwt?
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<spacebat> looks like it is, sorry for the confusion
<johnelse> spacebat: I just installed dns, and it's under .opam/4.01.0/lib/dns
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<spacebat> that's bizarre
<spacebat> maybe I didn't install things properly
<spacebat> should I try to wipe everything and reinstall opam?
<johnelse> if it's under 4.01.0/lib/lwt then it sounds like something's gone very wrong
<spacebat> good to know its probably something I did
<spacebat> the tests start with open Lwt
<johnelse> it might depend on Lwt, but it shouldn't have installed under the lwt directory
<spacebat> but I can't run them because ocaml complains of unbound module Lwt
<spacebat> more evidence that my install is broken
<spacebat> thanks
<johnelse> good luck :) I used to have to destroy .opam now and then, but I haven't for a while now
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<asmanur> is camlp4 supposed to compile in opam (ocaml 4.02)? I have a weird "Is a directory" exception not caught by ocamlbuild when trying to compile
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<Drup> whitequark: Not convinced by the fact that it's a webpage.
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<bernardo1pc> [ERROR] The compilation of ocamlfind.1.5.2 failed. -> eeek
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<Drup> AltGr: what are the correct things to do to so that ocamlfind install C generated files in the correct places with opam ?
<Drup> It doesn't work by default :/
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<AltGr> ugh what OS ?
<Drup> linux
<Drup> the ocamlfind package is half-assed, and it's not mind, so it's *possible* broken, but I would like to actually know that
<Drup> mine*
<AltGr> I need a little more context here...
<Drup> yeah, I guess
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<Drup> actually, I was testing with the toplevel, and it seems to work with the standard compiler
<Drup> so maybe it's just a toplevel issue
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<Drup> so, what would cause #require to cause "Error: The external function `n_is_null' is not available " ?
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<smondet> Drup: malformed ocamlfind package?
<smondet> oh you know that, I missed some backlog
<Drup> also, C things are installed in the wrong path, I had to add ".opam/4.01.0/lib/stublibs" in ld.conf
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<MercurialAlchemi> I'll rephrase my question from earlier
<MercurialAlchemi> Where can I get a non-broken file move function?
<MercurialAlchemi> fileutils?
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<Drup> could the lack of cmxs cause the issue with the toplevel ?
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<MercurialAlchemi> smondet: this looks involved
<AltGr> Drup: did you add the ~/.ocamlinit suggested by `opam init` ?
<AltGr> (you can re-run `opam init` to check safely)
<Drup> AltGr: I did, but a looong time ago
<Drup> has it changed ?
<AltGr> it didn't change
<AltGr> should still be a safer version of `Topdirs.dir_directory (Sys.getenv "OCAML_TOPLEVEL_PATH")`
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<Drup> so yes, I have it
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<AltGr> and OCAML_TOPLEVEL_PATH is set by `opam config env`
<Drup> but actually, the library isn't building cmxs, I think that is the actual issue.
<Drup> (wouldn't solve the thingy with ld.conf, no idea about this one)
* Drup is spoiled by oasis doing everything for him.
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<coder> Hello brilliant people. Trying to build a parser here in ocamlyacc. Got it mostly working, but it would be great if we could have errors be a bit more verbose. Please check it out at http://lpaste.net/885411592584298496
<coder> Right now, parse_error only outputs 'syntax error' when something fails
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<pippijn> coder: and https://github.com/pippijn/merr
<pippijn> coder: or do something with the token positions
<coder> ok
<pippijn> "syntax error near line/column, token"
<pippijn> you can do that with the lexer
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<pippijn> if you want proper syntax error support, you need the hack above
<coder> hmm
<coder> ok... this looks pretty nontrivial to implement.
<pippijn> which?
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<coder> welp, guess I'm sticking with export OCAMLRUNPARAM='p'
<pippijn> the line/column/token thing is easy
<coder> ok
<coder> merr looks rough
<pippijn> yes, sorry
<pippijn> I can't currently develop it
<coder> no, I don't mean bad
<pippijn> because of the company I work for
<coder> I mean it's way too powerful for what I need
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<pippijn> it has an easy mode :)
<pippijn> you don't have to use its power
<coder> I'm like braindead stupid, I wouldn't even know how to put it in.
<pippijn> you can just keep the default error message, which is "unexpected $token, expected one of $tokenlist"
<coder> yeah, that sounds great
<coder> is there an example implementation I could look at? I don't think the sample file works
<pippijn> anyway
<pippijn> it's probably not the right thing for you at this time
<coder> ok
<pippijn> I hope I get the open source stuff managed soon
<pippijn> so I can continue working on it :)
<coder> you mean licensing issues?
<pippijn> IP issues
<coder> ok
<pippijn> I own merr
<coder> cool
<pippijn> but if I continue working on it now, I won't own all of it anymore
<pippijn> because my company will confiscate the IP
<coder> ah right, cuz job
<coder> makes sense...
<pippijn> so I need to get a green card from the company for every one of my projects separately
<pippijn> "yes you can work on this, no we don't need to own this"
<coder> kinda messed up, but I guess that's how it works.
<pippijn> yep :\
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<coder> hmm... so what's the less intense option?
<coder> is there some kind of example or guide somewhere?
<pippijn> you store the source location information in the token
<pippijn> or externally
<pippijn> and on error, you output the last token and its position
<pippijn> ah yes
<pippijn> or that
<Drup> coder: this piece of code tries to parse, and if it fails, it get the position and the last token (and raise an exception)
<coder> yeah I saw something similar on stackoverflow but I could not figure out where to stick it
<coder> thanks for giving whole file
<Drup> err, the whole files does a lot of thing that are not related
<Drup> so, not sure how much you would benefit from it
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<coder> Yeah, it's quite different architectually from what i've cobbled together
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<Drup> https://github.com/Drup/LILiS/blob/master/lilis/lisUtils.ml#L150-L190 this is almost the whole stuff related to parsing, you can look at that
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<coder> ok thanks
<Drup> It's much more basic than what pippijn propose, but it's quick to do, just wrap your parsing function in some exception handling, and it's done
<coder> ok
<coder> I think I get it
<coder> thanks for the help
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<coder> thanks for the help