ChanServ changed the topic of ##yamahasynths to: Channel dedicated to questions and discussion of Yamaha FM Synthesizer internals and corresponding REing. Discussion of synthesis methods similar to the Yamaha line of chips, Sound Blasters + clones, PCM chips like RF5C68, and CD theory of operation are also on-topic. Channel logs: https://freenode.irclog.whitequark.org/~h~yamahasynths
<Lord_Nightmare>
not sure how relevant this is, but if anyone plans to run a patreon in the future, you should throw together a page and submit and launch it NOW, since after midnight pst tonight (in about 5.5 hours), the rate of take patreon has of all incoming donations goes WAY up from 5% to something like 8%
<Lord_Nightmare>
and if you launch a page now, even a placeholder page, you get locked into the old rates
<Lord_Nightmare>
and its free
<cr1901_modern>
No plans, but I've thought about it
<Lord_Nightmare>
you may as well do it, just put something really general in for what you're creating
<Lord_Nightmare>
creating "documentation on vintage yamaha fm synthesizer technology"
<Lord_Nightmare>
then you need a paragraph description, a profile graphic ("CR1901" in courier font on a white background is fine for this) and a titlebar background graphic which you can throw together in gimp or inkscape in 15 minutes
<Lord_Nightmare>
and that's it
<Lord_Nightmare>
once you launch it, its done, you're locked in. you can just leave it like that with no tiers or anything
* cr1901_modern
will quietly do this tonight
<cr1901_modern>
did you make a patreon page already?
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<Lord_Nightmare>
I did, and i know several other people who did
<cr1901_modern>
cr1901 is "occassionally drawing polygons and otherwise perpetually complaining about shit"
<Lord_Nightmare>
that works
<Wohali>
oh, not a bad idea. i'll get to that
<cr1901_modern>
Lord_Nightmare: Mind walking me through this please?
<Lord_Nightmare>
let me see...
<Lord_Nightmare>
first off, do you have a patreon patron/backer account? if not, create one.
<Lord_Nightmare>
then go to patreon.com/create
<Lord_Nightmare>
and the page should tell you what you need to do
<cr1901_modern>
Lord_Nightmare: Yes I have a pateron backer acct
<cr1901_modern>
I assume this means I'm locked into the old rates?
<cr1901_modern>
(How would I check :P?)
<Lord_Nightmare>
yep that's it
<Lord_Nightmare>
you're locked in
<Lord_Nightmare>
if you launched your page and it stays launched
<Lord_Nightmare>
as long as its befoe 11:59PST
<Lord_Nightmare>
pm
<cr1901_modern>
Cool... now if/when I ever decide to publicly launch this, ppl can throw away their money to me :P
<cr1901_modern>
(okay more seriously, ppl paying me would be a decent incentive to get my shit together)
<Nerionaya>
I publicly launched a patreon today and then didn't link to it in the public launch, because if people want to give me money I'm going to make them work for it lol
<Nerionaya>
but good to have the option of the lower fee if things change in the future
<Lord_Nightmare>
yep, that's why i did it as well
<Lord_Nightmare>
this will cause a one-month big boost to patreon's userbase, i'm sure, but it will vanish next month
<cr1901_modern>
Afaik, the WD PLL is very similar to the synchronous counter approach suggested by the NEC apnote I linked yesterday
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<superctr_>
<cr1901_modern> (Linked time) Gotta say, I was not aware the YM2612 could create sounds like this: https://youtu.be/FXRCROVCSrI?t=672 <- those are broken PCM samples
<superctr_>
Obvious since the drums were replaced
<cr1901_modern>
Oh well that's no fun :P
<cr1901_modern>
I wanted to be create AT Modem sounds from FM operators
<superctr_>
probably a pointer in Z80 memory got corrupted
<superctr_>
causing it to feed random ROM data to the YM2612
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<Wohali>
you're paying for his resaerch, i guess. obvs. the hardware isn't difficult.
<Wohali>
but managing sample-accurate like that is not easy
<superctr_>
i think you can do all this with a pi zero
<superctr_>
including the latency
<Wohali>
would like to see that code! When will it be ready? :D
<superctr_>
when you buy me a pi zero
<superctr_>
and the best thing
<superctr_>
most of the code already exists
<Sarayan>
segapcm, isn't that full ttl?
<superctr_>
the only thing to add would be sample triggering through midi, i2c, spi or whatever you need
<cr1901_modern>
>when you buy me a pi zero <-- c'mon now, it's 5 bucks plus 20 to make a usable system :P
<superctr_>
sure, that's a lot cheaper than the $80 + whatever else you need for this
<cr1901_modern>
I'm just saying- there's prob more overhead to getting donations for a pi zero than there is to just buying one yourself and eating the loss :P
<superctr_>
but you get a much more powerful SoC compared with the M7 micro in this thing, you won't get a dac though
<superctr_>
i'm not expecting anyone to actually buy me a pi zero
<superctr_>
i don't need one, i already have one :p
<Wohali>
it's the8 synchronous mono channel outputs that is the useful thing
<superctr_>
i just think it's a bit strange, i feel sampler hardware is pointless when a cheap SoC can do the same thing
<superctr_>
fair point regarding the 8ch output, the sega PCM doesn't have that either though :P
<fseidel>
the quality may be interesting, I seem to recall that the original Pi had terrible audio quality
<fseidel>
I assume the Zero is no different?
<superctr_>
the pi zero has no built in DAC
<superctr_>
you'll have to get one separately, so there are a few options to choose from
<superctr_>
regarding quality
<fseidel>
either way, probably cheaper than $80
<Sarayan>
adjusting control points is boooooooooooooooring
<superctr_>
the thing is that i think the pi zero would have no problems mixing hundreds of voices simultaneously
<Sarayan>
ctr: if they're at the exact same frequency
<fseidel>
so IIRC, isn't most stuff on Sparkfun like this
<superctr_>
i think the 32 you get from the micro in this tsunami board is the best it can do
<fseidel>
i.e. convenient but monstrously overpriced?
<superctr_>
i suppose
<superctr_>
you could use whatever resampler algo that the tsunami uses Sarayan
<superctr_>
it's not going to do any fancy resampling either
<fseidel>
these were the guys selling an STM32 with a python interpreter for like $50
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<Wohali>
fseidel: I mean, SOIC-to-DIP adapter boards still sell for like $8-$20. So, yeah, agafin, you're paying for convenience.
<Wohali>
But in this case I feel it's more like Teensy vs. Arduino. Roughly the same HW, but you're getting far better code.
<whitequark>
you can get very cheap adapter boards from the usual suspects in china
<Wohali>
But $70? Yeah, I'd probably contact the dev directly and ask what it'd cost to license his sw for cheaper for an embedded solution
<whitequark>
like you can get TSSOP48 adatpers for less than $10
<superctr_>
i think the software would be pretty simple
<superctr_>
it's an mcu streaming samples from an sd card to a dac over some serial protocol, probably SPI or I2C
<Sarayan>
sd cards are flow, so you need to manage some caching
<Sarayan>
slow
<superctr_>
it's an I2S dac anyway
<superctr_>
buffering is also not hard
<superctr_>
it depends on how much latency you want to (not) have
<superctr_>
the entire right side of that board is the PCM player
<superctr_>
left side
<whitequark>
ahhh
<cr1901_modern>
Reminds me how on bootleg Super Mario Bros arcade boards, the PPU would be done using discrete logic
<cr1901_modern>
but the sound would be done- badly- using a z80
<superctr_>
sound is often considered "less important" on arcade bootlegs
<superctr_>
when they bootleg games with custom sound chips, they don't bother cloning it
<cr1901_modern>
not to mention, the NES sound chip is on the CPU die
<cr1901_modern>
probably a bit complicated to extract that out to discrete
<superctr_>
just put a cheaper alternative there. in the early days it was probably a microcontroller or similar, but later they would just use OKI MSM6295 chips
<fseidel>
cr1901_modern: wait, did they emulate the APU in software on a Z80?
<superctr_>
no
<superctr_>
they used 3x SN76489 (!)
<superctr_>
my guess is that the Z80 would map APU register writes to the SN76489s
<superctr_>
i would like to hear how it sounds but it doesn't seem like there's any sound working in MAME (and it is marked MACHINE_NOT_WORKING)
<cr1901_modern>
z80 intercepted address lines of the 6502 to determine when a write to an audio I/O port occurred
<cr1901_modern>
and then stopped the 6502 and took control to write the relevant data to the sound chips