<luke_nukem>
Given that IPFS is dedup, what happens when a node which is the only node with a set of particular blocks goes offline permanently? The associated files/objects are now corrupted and lost aren't they?
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<JCaesar>
Yes.
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<engdesart>
Lost, yes.
<JCaesar>
But you might misunderstand dedup. It dedups locally. But two nodes can hold the same objects.
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<luke_nukem>
JCaesar: yeah I think I may be misunderstanding a part of it.
<engdesart>
Also, those blocks aren't lost to the machine that went offline, as it can access them via localhost.
<luke_nukem>
The network doesn't strive to have only one set of blocks with no duplication (disregarding locally)?
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<JCaesar>
I guess that describes it well enough, yes.
<lemmi>
that would be a fast death to the network
<lemmi>
or any storage system
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<luke_nukem>
That's what I imagined. Couldn't see how there would be any guarantee to prevent any corruption otherwise.
<luke_nukem>
Having said that though, nodes don't aim to collect all blocks at all do they? Only what they require, such as per a request for something?
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<lemmi>
you only get what you tell the node to request.
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<deltab>
luke_nukem: nodes request the blocks they want, and then cache them for a while, and make them available to others
<deltab>
so commonly requested blocks can replicated in many places
<deltab>
^can^get^
<lemmi>
i think the garbage collector isn't enabled by default, so you will keep what you requested once
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<lemmi>
unless you manually run the garbage collector or enable it to clean automatically at a high watermark
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<luke_nukem>
What do you think the chances of a file going "missing" would be?
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<luke_nukem>
Sorry about all the questions - I'm required to research this for work, and some things aren't too obvious in the papers I've read.
<lemmi>
if you depend on it, host it yourself
<lemmi>
otherwise don't depend on it
<deltab>
that's fine, it's helpful to know how ipfs is perceived
<lemmi>
or get someone to host it for you
<lemmi>
luke_nukem: if you know a little how bittorrent works, it's very similar in that regard
<engdesart>
Hosting it oneself allows one to access it offline, which can be surprisingly helpful.
<deltab>
files will disappear when there's no-one interested in making them available
<deltab>
but anyone with the data can reseed, unlike the current web
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<luke_nukem>
Excellent, thanks for the info.
<luke_nukem>
Hmm, so last question I think - Is there such a thing as a global entrypoint list for use via API?
<alexThinkpad>
what is about ipfs better than what existed before
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<lemmi>
it combines a lot of things a useful way
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<luke_nukem>
alexThinkpad: I'd say it takes the best of many worlds and combines what was learned from them, in a coherent and well done way.
<lemmi>
there are similar projects, but with different trade-offs
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<alexThinkpad>
it combines especially which concepts?
<luke_nukem>
Would I be correct in assuming that if one doesn't save the hash of a freshly added file, then there is no easy way to get/ref that file?
<lemmi>
yes
<JCaesar>
It will appear in the webui.
<JCaesar>
But yeah, if you don't know which…
<JCaesar>
(Which is why I manage my added files through ipfs files cp…)
<lemmi>
you can list all hashes registered within a repo. so it's feasable to find something on a almost empty repo, but once you made some traffic - not so much
<luke_nukem>
Hmm... dedup locally. Nodes can duplicate. If a node catches fire and it is the only one with a particular block, that block is lost. If no nodes request particular blocks for X time, then those blocks may "go away". Files can be pinned to keep them around..
<JCaesar>
lemmi: There is still ipfs pin ls.
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<lemmi>
JCaesar: yes, still the same problem
<luke_nukem>
ipfs files - this looks like it works similar to say... Dropbox?
<lemmi>
not at all
<lemmi>
ipfs files is just a convenient way to build unixfs trees
<JCaesar>
öhhh… no? What do you mean by "made some traffic"? Just because you request some files, they won't be on your pin list…
<lemmi>
JCaesar: yes, but once you pinned a lot, same problem
<JCaesar>
Indeed.
<lemmi>
i don't think the list is sorted
<luke_nukem>
I think I have a wee ways to go before I get a complete picture of IPFS...
<lemmi>
just toy around with it
<luke_nukem>
Time to write an API interaction library I think (probably a "Yet Another xyz"
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<lemmi>
i don't think you can learn a lot from that
<lemmi>
the api closely mirrors what you type into the commandline anyway
<lemmi>
so that won't teach you the concepts
<luke_nukem>
lemmi: yeah true, but that's all I need for now. Next step *may* be writing a partial client - but, I'm not sure if a "lite" client would be tolerated?
<luke_nukem>
I only need abilities to add, get, verify really.
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<JCaesar>
That sounds like a lot of work…
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<luke_nukem>
JCaesar: It's my job...
<luke_nukem>
I work for a business that is developing an Identity Management solution. Feeling my way around a few things.
<lemmi>
all the p2p stuff isn't even accessible through the api
<lemmi>
so even less useful
<alexThinkpad>
is ipfs better than anything before?
<lemmi>
alexThinkpad: it's so hard to answer questions like that. could you fill in specifics that are important to you?
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<lemmi>
it's bad for censorship for example
<lemmi>
if you want that, ipfs is worse in that regard
<JCaesar>
alexThinkpad: Have you seen anything like ipfs that came before it?
<JCaesar>
It also doesn't care about anonymity, btw.
<lemmi>
that's not entirely true.
<lemmi>
all communication is encrypted. i think there's also a tor transport half-done somewhere.
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<luke_nukem>
Wait, is there a linkable library somewhere?
<lemmi>
i don't think so
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<lemmi>
but there are 3rd party implementations (or attempts) in other languages
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<luke_nukem>
there are more users here than in the Rust language channel
<engdesart>
alexThinkpad: Only really for a few use cases, particularly for distributing scientific and academic datasets/documents.
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<luke_nukem>
block size is 256kb right? (just looking at output of block list)
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<engdesart>
luke_nukem: That's the default, yes.
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<jfmherokiller[m]>
an example of a scientific data set stored on ipfs can be found here /ipfs/QmW3JcN1oLGU1VAQ5NnmV3c6BFgPaj76uVhtphFd5PQk4q its the human genomic dataset GRCh38
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<jfmherokiller[m]>
I didnt unpack the data because i did not want to risk eating all of my hardrive space lol
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<JCaesar>
Argh, only the local key appears in a mounted ipns, not other generated keys?
<JCaesar>
Argh, only the local key appears in a mounted ipns, not other generated keys?
<JCaesar>
… (not scrolling to the end and forgetting that you already sent the line. mpfh)
<JCaesar>
Anyway, is there another way I can get a modifiable mounted folder that I can get an /ipfs/… path to at the end of my modifications?
<lemmi>
JCaesar: you can just change to any direcoty
<JCaesar>
that does not seem to terminate…
<JCaesar>
and… can I modify that?
<lemmi>
you can modify files in your local namespace
<JCaesar>
I'm already using that for something else…
<tbenett>
I configured upstart to launch ipfs at startup and it's ok. However I can't use the HTTP anymore: neither 127.0.0.1 or localhost allow me to hit the API
<tbenett>
do you have any idea why?
<JCaesar>
Upstart pulling any funny firewall things in the background?
<JCaesar>
lemmi: I'm already using that for something else…
<JCaesar>
Guess I'll have to use subfolders.
<tbenett>
JCeasar: not that I'm aware of. How can I know?
<lemmi>
JCaesar: the ipns mount point isn't able to use other local keys for modification, no