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<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] whyrusleeping created feat/local-add (+1 new commit): https://git.io/v61dh
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/feat/local-add 4b27885 Jeromy: ipfs/add: make --local flag not write out providers...
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<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] whyrusleeping created feat/pin/no-prov-internal (+1 new commit): https://git.io/v61Ni
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/feat/pin/no-prov-internal db228e1 Jeromy: pin: use separate dagservice for storing pinsets...
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<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] whyrusleeping opened pull request #3102: ipfs/add: make --local flag not write out providers (master...feat/local-add) https://git.io/v61NP
<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] whyrusleeping opened pull request #3103: pin: use separate dagservice for storing pinsets (master...feat/pin/no-prov-internal) https://git.io/v61NX
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<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] whyrusleeping created feat/bitswap/dup-prov-cache (+1 new commit): https://git.io/v61xf
<whyrusleeping>
or '?timeout=10s' to the end of that url
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<lgierth>
whyrusleeping: hey just wanted to write the same :P it's not documented though
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<tymat>
ah okay let me try that
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<whyrusleeping>
lgierth: long time no see :D
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<lgierth>
o/
<lgierth>
:)
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<lgierth>
i just told arceliar that the smart thing he invented over there is called a varint
<lgierth>
:)
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<whyrusleeping>
lol
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<whyrusleeping>
poor guy
<whyrusleeping>
i bet he was excited about it too
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<lgierth>
yes yes! :)
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<pjz>
is there any demand for a for-pay pinning service?
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<jakobvarmose>
pjz, Interesting idea. I doubt many people would pay though
<pjz>
I was thinking of keeping it kind of anonymous: give me a list of hashes and some bitcoin and I'll pin them (recursively, of course) for as long as the bitcoin lasts (at some gb/hr rate)
<pjz>
if you want it pinned longer, just add more time the same way
<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] whyrusleeping created feat/cmds/dht-provide (+1 new commit): https://git.io/v61js
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/feat/cmds/dht-provide eaa433f Jeromy: cmds: implement ipfs dht provide command...
<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] whyrusleeping opened pull request #3106: cmds: implement ipfs dht provide command (master...feat/cmds/dht-provide) https://git.io/v61j0
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<kevina>
Kubuxu: You by chance around?
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<jakobvarmose>
pjz, You could try. Maybe also have a list of all the pinned objects so it's easy to find stuff
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<pjz>
jakobvarmose: oh, yeah, have to keep track of everything that's been pinned and when and for how long
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<pjz>
jakobvarmose: I dunno about 'easy to find stuff' though
<pjz>
my main worry is that the DHT isn't up to the job at the moment :)
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<jakobvarmose>
pjz, What I meant was to have a public list on your website so the pinned objects get some exposure
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<jakobvarmose>
Why do you think the dht can't handle it?
<kevina>
It used go-datastore, but I am 100% sure how it stored the keys
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<jakobvarmose>
base58 encoding would be a bit slow so probably hex or binary
<jakobvarmose>
I was also thinking about that when CIDv1 gets implemented, doing reference counting will be a bit harder as the same object may be referenced but with different codecs
<redfish>
brendyn: nice link. boycotting is a silly reaction, but docker is a silly lazy solution to software packaging.
<kevina>
jakobvarmose: right now my hunch it telling me that a simple solution of just storing the reference count in the datastore might still work
<kevina>
but since that might of been tried before I am only 51% sure :)
<kevina>
I don't have time to really dig into this now, but things I would like to know
<kevina>
(1) What is the diskspace overhead for each leveldb key, if key size is say 64 bytes, and the size of the data is say 8 bytes. How much space will that use?
<kevina>
(2) Why was the solution so slow, will batching help with the stores?
<brendyn>
redfish: I wish I could just get ipfs with git clone; configure; make, or something like that.
<redfish>
brendyn: isn't ipfs packaged for all major distros? on Arch, it's just a matter of installing the package.
<brendyn>
only 4.2
<kevina>
(3) where indirect keys stored individually under something like /local/pins/indirect/<BLOCK HASH>, or was it something more complicated
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<jakobvarmose>
kevina, I also think so, but as you say maybe we are wrong
<redfish>
brendyn: yeah, that's why rolling distors are nice -- on Arch go-ipfs-git from AUR... never behind
<jakobvarmose>
(1) Probably not that much, but I don't know how leveldb works
<jakobvarmose>
(2) How would you batch?
<kevina>
by using the batching primitives of the datastore
<brendyn>
redfish: Yeah I've got that on my laptop :). Unless I reinstall my Pi with ARM version of Parabola
<jakobvarmose>
whyrusleeping, Oh, I misunderstood the code. sorry
<whyrusleeping>
no worries, i'm just occasionally glancing at irc while playing factorio
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<kevina>
I am having a hard time figuring out the code but it looks like something more complicated is going on than storing each indirect pin user something like /local/pins/indirect/<BLOCK HASH>
<jakobvarmose>
whyrusleeping, Factorio never heard of that game before. Is it fun?
<jakobvarmose>
kevina, That would also be the most logical. I'll have a look. Is the hash in hex?
<whyrusleeping>
jakobvarmose: its all the addicting parts of minecraft put together, minus the rest of it
<kevina>
It is now in Base32
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<whyrusleeping>
kevina: the way pinning currently works, is we store the set of all recursive pins, and the set of all direct pins
<whyrusleeping>
those are stored in a set built on top of ipfs objects
<whyrusleeping>
the root hash of those objects is kept in leveldb
<kevina>
whyrusleeping: thanks, was something more direct like /local/pins/XXX/<BLOCK HASH> ever tried?
<whyrusleeping>
yeah, it was farther before 0.3.11 though
<kevina>
The problem with /local/pins/indirect/<BLOCK HASH> is that an update would still be required
<kevina>
to increment the could the key would need to be read and updated and then put
<kevina>
And that could create a race condition that could inhibit batching
<kevina>
Another idea I just thought of is store indirect pins as /local/pins/indirect/<BLOCK HASH>/<PARENT>
<kevina>
The value is irrelevant, the key contains all the need information.
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<whyrusleeping>
the overhead on that is fairly significant
<whyrusleeping>
thats probably (using leveldb) going to be at least 100 bytes overhead per pin
<whyrusleeping>
plus the perf hit of having to write that on every pin
<kevina>
whyrusleeping: that is how batching could help. Write all indirect pins for a recursive pin on one go.
<whyrusleeping>
still, batching doesnt help *that* much
<jakobvarmose>
Has a counting bloom filter been tried?
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<kevina>
whyrusleeping, thanks, I will take your word for it. However, I am also stubborn and will likely need to see the numbers for my self :)
<kevina>
Nothing to worry about this is something that would be easy to prototype, if and when, I decide to take this on :)
<whyrusleeping>
kevina: yeah, definitely go benchmark shit if youre interested
<whyrusleeping>
we could have been doing something horribly wrong the first time around
<whyrusleeping>
jakobvarmose: it hasnt yet, its on the to try list
<whyrusleeping>
the problem is making sure it stays perfectly up to date
<jakobvarmose>
whyrusleeping, yeah and it shouldn't give too many false positives so unneccesary objects are not kept
<jakobvarmose>
But I don't think a bloom filter will be fast as it will have to store data 10-20 different places for each insertion
<kevina>
whyrusleeping: Do you consider the space overhead a problem?
<whyrusleeping>
jakobvarmose: maybe, i'd have to profile it
<whyrusleeping>
kevina: yeah, i think it will be, lots of objects are going to be pretty small. overhead per block is killer
<whyrusleeping>
i'm gonna go get some sleep now, i'll try and read up on backlog in the morning
<jakobvarmose>
Most blocks will have a reference count of either 0 or 1. So it might make sense to have one datastructure to store these, and another one to deal with the few blocks that have higher reference counts
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<jakobvarmose>
whyrusleeping, good night
<kevina>
whyrusleeping: good night
<kevina>
jakobvarmose: yes that makes sense
<kevina>
I am not completely sold on the idea of using a bloom filter. As if the object is pinned an expensive check still must be done.
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<jakobvarmose>
kevina, Not sure I understand. When would this expensive check happen?
<kevina>
So a bloom filter normally returns a "possibly in set". If we need to find out if an object really is pinned we still need to go back to walking all the recursive pins.
<kevina>
Or maybe I mis-understand something. I admit I never really used a bloom filter before.
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<kevina>
My other idea I had was to implement some sort of in-memory datastructure but write it in such a way that mmap can be used.
<kevina>
That is don't use pointers, only indexes so it doesn't matter where in memory it is.
<kevina>
Let the OS take care of many of the details of managing memory.
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<kevina>
No idea how practical that would be or if it will even help.
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<kevina>
Basically I don't have any really good ideas :) If a direct leveldb has to much overhead I was thinking maybe try something else, https://github.com/avelino/awesome-go has a list
<jakobvarmose>
kevina, True, if you want to absolutely certain it is indeed pinned, you will still have to walk the graph
<jakobvarmose>
but an in memory data structure can't really be faster than a simple map, can it?
<jakobvarmose>
But it might be better for memory usage
<kevina>
That is the idea. Could use mmap so that we don't have to keep the entire thing in memory.
<kevina>
If it is really really large we could have address space problems on 32-bit platforms though.
<jakobvarmose>
but it shouldn't be that large. If we have 1 million objects and they each use 100 bytes that would still only be 100 MB
<kevina>
True. But whyrusleeping thought even 100 bytes was too much overhead so I think is thinking of the case of many many small objects.
<kevina>
How small and how many I don't know as I found 100 bytes of overhead acceptable. There is probably some sort of other use case he was thinking of.
<kevina>
Anyway, I need to sign off for now. Time for to to get to bed.
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<jakobvarmose>
kevina, maybe. Good night
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<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs] diasdavid force-pushed feat/generic-spec-compliant from e035dab to b28ae1f: https://git.io/v6MID
<ipfsbot>
js-ipfs/feat/generic-spec-compliant b28ae1f David Dias: wip
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<Kubuxu>
morning
<Kubuxu>
now I am up :p
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<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs] diasdavid pushed 1 new commit to config-api: https://git.io/v6Mms
<ipfsbot>
js-ipfs/config-api cc0c8fd David Dias: feat(bitswap tests, config, id): cope with the nuances of the config API (.replace) and make necessary changes to make it all work again
<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs] diasdavid pushed 1 new commit to feat/generic-spec-compliant: https://git.io/v6MYv
<ipfsbot>
js-ipfs/feat/generic-spec-compliant df02596 David Dias: fix(core): all tests passing
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<jakobvarmose>
whyrusleeping, kevina, I looked into cuckoo filters and they look very promising. We should be able to store 1 million keys in about 25 MB. And with no false positives
<jakobvarmose>
I don't know how fast it is though, but I nearly have a working implementation so I can test
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<Kubuxu>
there is no "no false positives" in probabilistic data structures
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<Kubuxu>
jakobvarmose: also if you wanted to store pinset in cuckoo filter you have to take into account that N references to the same block in pinset will require N entries in chockoo filter.
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<Kubuxu>
but the idea is good, just the filter size might need to be bigger and we need to be able to expand it.
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<jakobvarmose>
Kubuxu, In theory there could be false positives but they will happen with so low probability it doesn't matter
<jakobvarmose>
Yes in a normal cuckoo filter, but by adding a counter to each field this can be avoided
<Kubuxu>
It can be mitigated by changing hash function slightly when expanding the filter.
<Kubuxu>
This way elements that would be false positive won't be.
<Kubuxu>
Then you would need to store side data with the table, which increases complexity.
<jakobvarmose>
I'm not sure I understand what you mean. In my current imlementation I just use sha-256 truncated to 20 bytes
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<Kubuxu>
about changing the hash function?
<jakobvarmose>
yes
<Kubuxu>
lets say that A (which is pinned) and B(which isn't) have collision because they hash to the same truncated value. If you run GC, B won't be removed, but if filter is rebuilt (because it is too small or something) you can change the hashing function (use higher bits of sha, instead of lower or some other modification), and there is great chance that they won't be colliding in new filter. This means that
<Kubuxu>
element that was previously in the collison and coudn't be removed, now will be removed when GC is run.
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<jakobvarmose>
Kubuxu, Oh now I understand. But that shouldn't really be necessary
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<Kubuxu>
I know, because the false positive should be low enough.
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<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs] diasdavid pushed 1 new commit to feat/generic-spec-compliant: https://git.io/v6MWq
<ipfsbot>
js-ipfs/feat/generic-spec-compliant 31f673d David Dias: feat(http): Refactor inject tests, made them all pass again
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<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs] diasdavid pushed 1 new commit to feat/generic-spec-compliant: https://git.io/v6M4i
<ipfsbot>
js-ipfs/feat/generic-spec-compliant e13b52d David Dias: feat(http): refactor ipfs-api tests and make them all pass again
<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs] diasdavid deleted config-api at cc0c8fd: https://git.io/v6M4X
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<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs] diasdavid force-pushed feat/generic-spec-compliant from e13b52d to 1ff5348: https://git.io/v6MID
<ipfsbot>
js-ipfs/feat/generic-spec-compliant 1ff5348 David Dias: feat(http): refactor ipfs-api tests and make them all pass again
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<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs] diasdavid force-pushed feat/generic-spec-compliant from 1ff5348 to 7ef9b92: https://git.io/v6MID
<ipfsbot>
js-ipfs/feat/generic-spec-compliant 7ef9b92 David Dias: feat(http): refactor ipfs-api tests and make them all pass again
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<furao>
I have been looking at IPFS for a while and it fill almost all the needs for my app architecture… except one thing. it’s not really a pubsub concept but rather a single 1 way message. like notify $NodeIdA that I care about $SomeHashId
<furao>
and if $NodeIdA is running it get the value $SomeHashId and the public id of the sender of the message
<furao>
or even better, it can get that msg once it go online
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<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] Kubuxu pushed 1 new commit to test/unixfs/reader-cover: https://git.io/v6Mu3
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/test/unixfs/reader-cover edcd650 Jakub Sztandera: test: add absolute seek test...
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<ipfsbot>
[js-ipfs-api] diasdavid pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6Mug
<ipfsbot>
js-ipfs-api/master b24dab8 David Dias: Merge pull request #354 from ipfs/greenkeeper-aegir-7.0.0...
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<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] Kubuxu pushed 1 new commit to test/unixfs/reader-cover: https://git.io/v6Mgc
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/test/unixfs/reader-cover 209de19 Jakub Sztandera: test: add relative seek test to dagreader...
<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] Kubuxu force-pushed test/unixfs/reader-cover from 209de19 to 294ff0e: https://git.io/v6ihh
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/test/unixfs/reader-cover f63266a Jakub Sztandera: test: add basic dagreader test...
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/test/unixfs/reader-cover 086f110 Jakub Sztandera: test: use mdag/test.Mock() instead...
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/test/unixfs/reader-cover 3c57ffa Jakub Sztandera: test: refactor some utities out of mod package...
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<MrSparc>
Hello folks, a question from a newbie ipfs hacker contributor: How to enable logging in order to see the log events raised by ipfs/go-log ?
<ipfsbot>
[go-ipfs] Kubuxu pushed 1 new commit to test/unixfs/reader-cover: https://git.io/v6M2R
<ipfsbot>
go-ipfs/test/unixfs/reader-cover c443ca4 Jakub Sztandera: test: add reverse relative seeking test to dagreader...
<Kubuxu>
MrSparc: there are two types of logs, EvenLogs: you can see those with `ipfs log tail` and normal logs which you can enable with sub command of `ipfs log` use `ipfs log --help` for more details
<Kubuxu>
MrSparc: if you want to enable logging during ipfs daemon start of in deamonless mode: IPFS_LOGGING=debug environment variable
<MrSparc>
Thanks @Kubuxu ... I will use logs to try to understand a problem I have with the current version (built into Windows). I cannot access objects by using the prefix "/ipfs/"
<MrSparc>
Example:
<MrSparc>
ipfs init initializing ipfs node at C:\Users\Ariel\.ipfs generating 2048-bit RSA keypair...done peer identity: QmSXokiUW4Z2KtchnMBmBwtAdKWg1msrCDXL518vRN1Nvq to get started, enter: ipfs cat /ipfs/QmYwAPJzv5CZsnA625s3Xf2nemtYgPpHdWEz79ojWnPbdG/readme