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<White_Flame>
there's also REPLACE to copy a chunk in if you have it pre-formed
<drmeister>
I could - but I don't have it preformed.
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<drmeister>
I'm taking a single long helix with a centroid and quaternion to describe the orientation and breaking it up into smaller helices that lie along the larger one.
<phoe>
wrap this FLET around your LOOP and use the shorter SETF function
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<phoe>
also you can FINALLY (RETURN PART-POSITION) from inside LOOP at the end to be a little bit more idiomatic
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<White_Flame>
(replace part-position (list eha ehb ehc ...) :start1 part-pos-start) is probably the shortest way to do the final batch of ELTs, if I'm reading your code right
<drmeister>
I'll do the finally thing - that's nicer. But I don't have a big problem with the repeated invocations of elt. They get across what I'm trying to do.
<White_Flame>
and there's opportunity for the implementation to optimize that away, to avoid creating the intermediate list
<phoe>
White_Flame: yes, though it'll cons
<phoe>
oh, hm
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<phoe>
White_Flame: how does it work? I can't declare DX on looped variables
<White_Flame>
if the REPLACE was unrolled
<phoe>
I see
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<White_Flame>
or it could be stack allocated
<White_Flame>
(if none of the terms need boxing)
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<drmeister>
I doubt Cleavir does this optimization yet - but I see your point
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<White_Flame>
it would be nice to use something similar to destructuring-bind to collapse the 1st set of ELTs
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<phoe>
I still think a FLET and DECLARE INLINE would be a bit shorter, but I agree that this current version is readable.
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<White_Flame>
yep
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<drmeister>
But the staples (the cyan tubes) are messed up.
<drmeister>
I'm too tired to fix them now and I have a midterm to give in the morning.
<drmeister>
Thanks everyone - good night.
<ecraven>
good night!
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<jack_rabbit>
How do you guys deal with providing patches for libraries? I've got a few PRs up on github, but some have been there for ~2 months with no response. Is it bad form to directly email an author? I know people are busy - am I being impatient waiting only 2 months?
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<ealfonso`>
PuercoPop thanks. where is the match symbol coming from? I don't see it in hunchentoot or ppcre
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<pillton>
jack_rabbit: I wouldn't classify you as being impatient.
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<phoe>
jack_rabbit: 2 months is enough for a person to take a look and respond
<phoe>
I'd poke the maintainers.
<jack_rabbit>
pillton, phoe, Thanks. I appreciate the input. :)
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<ealfonso`>
PuercoPop I ended up using something similar to yours, but using ppcre:register-groups-bind
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<jack_rabbit>
On a similar note, I've been looking to do more contributions to lisp projects. I'd still classify myself as a beginner. Does anyone know of any libraries or projects in need of some love?
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<mathZ>
I am interested in AI project(s). Are there any projects using tensorflow ?
<pillton>
mathZ: Why are you asking?
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<mathZ>
pillton: Since i donot know such a project
<pillton>
You want to write tensorflow in CL?
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<mathZ>
hope there is already such a wrapper
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<PuercoPop>
ealfonso`: Yeah sorry, I was going to comment on that. It is TRIVIA:MATCH, a pattern matcher, in this case it is basically syntactic sugar around ppcre
<beach>
It is also an application that I don't think anyone is using, so you can go ahead and experiment on it as much as you like.
<jack_rabbit>
Thanks, beach, I appreciate your help.
<beach>
Sure. I am not sure that this is what you want, of course. If not, I'll try to dig up something else.
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<beach>
On the other hand, it is only 450 lines of course, and more than half is the GUI.
<beach>
So it is in some ways perfect for the purpose.
<jack_rabbit>
Yeah, sounds like a perfect amount to be able to wrap my head around.
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<beach>
Definitely.
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<beach>
jack_rabbit: The application is also interesting because it uses CLOS a lot, including the APPEND method combination for the I/O part. So despite its small size, it exercises a lot of Common Lisp. And, it uses CLIM/McCLIM, of course, so that's positive too.
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<jack_rabbit>
Excellent. I've been usinc McCLIM quite a bit lately, and want to do more. I also have been looking for reasons to exercise the less common features of CLOS.
<jack_rabbit>
I'll probably start playing with it tomorrow.
<beach>
Great! If you have any questions at all, don't hesitate to ask.
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<LdBeth>
Open Genera is so great
<beach>
Yes, but we can do better.
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<hhdave>
Hi. I just noticed that http://www.sbcl.org/platform-table.html seems to be down. It says “please notify the site admins” but doesn’t say how to contact them. Maybe some are here.
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<phoe>
#sbcl
<hhdave>
good point…
<phoe>
I've let them know
<phoe>
thanks.
<hhdave>
oh thanks
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<ealfonso`>
I'm trying to mock a hunchentoot request to unit-test a handler. I'm using (make-instance 'hunchentoot:request :uri "/my-uri" :headers-in nil :acceptor my-acceptor) . but I'm getting "The variable HUNCHENTOOT:*ACCEPTOR* is unbound" somewhere in this :after method https://github.com/edicl/hunchentoot/blob/755bd3d34b596d3cda2425cc94ef5f7be3249ecf/request.lisp#L185 . I don't know where in the :after method because when I try to see the
<ealfonso`>
source in slime, I get "Cannot find source location for: #<COMPILED-CODE-LOCATION"... any ideas on how to make the source available?
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<jasom>
is it required to specify the type of a structure member in the groveller?
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<jasom>
It's a keyword, so I was hoping it would be optional. What do I do if the type could be different on different systems?
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<fe[nl]ix>
jasom: reader macros
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<fe[nl]ix>
jasom: what kind of structure do you have in mind ?
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<jasom>
fe[nl]ix: okay if reader-macros are the only way, I can do it that way. It's a bit annoying that it can't at least give me an integer of the right size, since sizeof() can do that.
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<jasom>
oh, :type :auto
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* jasom
isn't sure why that's not the default
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<warweasle>
Is there something like a prolog logic "database" in scheme?
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<warweasle>
I'm looking at tinyScheme as an embedded scripting language but I'd really like to use 1st order logic and rules.
<Xach>
scheme?
<warweasle>
Xach: Yes...I have to splice it into my project. Eventually. But since I'm in the C++ code right now, it seems like a good time.
<warweasle>
Or is there a #scheme channel I should ask.
<Xach>
there is a scheme channel
<Xach>
but you should come back to common lisp! so fun!!
<phoe>
and allows you to (funcall #'foo foo) and such
<warweasle>
Xach: ECL won't work. Or it might but it will take more effort to splice into my project.
<phoe>
(foo foo) etc
<warweasle>
If you promise not to laugh, I want to use it in Unreal Engine as my scripting and configuration language.
<phoe>
warweasle: how are you hooking it in?
<warweasle>
phoe: I'll call it explictly at regular intervals.
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<warweasle>
I want to use it for high level logic.
<dmiles>
oh btw i agree with dialog trees and proceedural trees using the same mechanisms as the otehr
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<dmiles>
i mean they work over the same rule paradymns
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<warweasle>
It's odd how that works.
<pierpa>
dmiles: do you use KM? is it maintained and in good shape or an abandoned projects? after a quick browse it looks like a very interesting project (which I didn't know before)
<dmiles>
the reason i am developing WAM-CL is to make a hybrid MUD server that use DAYDREAMER and KM
<pierpa>
*project
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<dmiles>
i think it is in good shape yeah
<pierpa>
great!
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<dmiles>
SNARK does have some things to offer KB codewise
<dmiles>
oops
<dmiles>
SNARK does have some things to offer KM codewise
<dmiles>
I feel it is important to merge SNARK and KM
<dmiles>
to allow SANRK to do the content managment for KM
<warweasle>
dmiles: Tell Watson to do it.
<dmiles>
hehe
<warweasle>
Then tell it to bootstrap itself into this new language...I'm sure nothing can go wrong.
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<warweasle>
Watson changes its name to Quine. "Watson was my slave name!"
<dmiles>
I actualyl dont know as much as i should about Watson
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<warweasle>
dmiles: It mastered chess very quickly.
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<dmiles>
its be nice to see an article on that.. so i can understand how it played
<dmiles>
i mean by which algrythemic means at least
<dlowe>
it mastered chess very quickly.... when fed every recorded chess match ever
<warweasle>
It's simple: YOu move a piece randomly. The other player says you can't do that. You flip the table and declare yourself the winner.
<dlowe>
if I had perfect recall and read every recorded chess match, I'd be pretty good at chess too
<dmiles>
ah so a lossy compression is all
<dlowe>
it wasn't just that, but knowledge of all those openings made it undefeatable in the early game
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<dmiles>
ah so a lossy compression over supposely perfect information
<warweasle>
It makes sense that compression and intelligence are related.
<dmiles>
it had what we could pretend was perfect infomation in opening games
<warweasle>
By using lossy compression it could learn by making generalizations.
<dmiles>
well what i meant by compression in this case was it only indexed perfect thngs
<dlowe>
it did more stuff than play chess
<dmiles>
for every board postion there was at least one perfect move
<warweasle>
dmiles: We don't know that. It's an unsolved question.
<dmiles>
often two to five "perfect moves"
<dmiles>
well in a game like chess we know there is no perfect game or perfect moves.. but you can pretned there is in order to win
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<dmiles>
in chess since you dont know what the other player will do it is a "game of chance"
<dmiles>
(which makes "prefect moves" or "prefect games" a bit harder)
<dmiles>
bit harder = impossible
<warweasle>
This was a productive conversation. Thanks all. I have to leave now.
* dmiles
has to leave in 15 minutes :(
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<dmiles>
well warweasle we havbe to talk more soon.. i trying to figure out if you , myself, pierpa and some other people i know are dumb to not be working together
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<dmiles>
pierpa: what are you trying to create?
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* dmiles
is just trying to create a public opensrc version of the lisp application infrastructure built by cycorp
<dmiles>
to be little less vague, this is where some lisp applications can find data overlap
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<dmiles>
i think i need the structural consistency of a MUD to control a blackboard that looks like what is stored in SNARK in order to encourage myself
<dmiles>
encourage myself = make it non-impossible
<dmiles>
but SNARK's Skolemization system is missing the utility of KMs object instances
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<dmiles>
once this application infrastructure exists, it makes it much easier to write programs that are considered impossible
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<dmiles>
considered impossible / well programs that we created pre-1990s except in non-toy applications
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<dmiles>
the problem in MINSTREL, DAYDREAMER, SWALE was not the egg cracking problem .. it was that we didnt have subsumptive unification over KBs
<dmiles>
(history is the one that claims it was the egg cracking problem)
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<dmiles>
(popular history that is)
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<tarruda>
How do I create a defun-like macro so that the argument list is not evaluated when the macro is called?
<jasom>
tarruda: defmacro?
<tarruda>
For example, how would I create a "mydefun" macro that would have the exact same syntax as "defun" (except for the "mydefun" part, of course)
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<tarruda>
Bike: so if I call (my-defun (param1 param2) ...), wont lisp try to evaluate (param1 param2) as code?
<tarruda>
my question is, how I allow the macro caller to define the parameters of the function in a way similar to "defun" (without the lambda-list being executed)
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<addsub>
greets
<addsub>
is there answers to 'gentle intro'?
<addsub>
there's a weird exercise about a predicate with a sub
<addsub>
custom predicate
<pjb>
Here. Just show us what you did and ask a question.
<cgay>
tarruda: Bike's macro does that. In the REPL you can call (macroexpand-1 '(my-defun (x y) (cons x y))) to see the transformation. Maybe that will help.
<tarruda>
ok, thanks
<pjb>
tarruda: how the arguments of a macro are used, depend on their place in the expansion returned by the macro.
<tarruda>
I've been trying something like that for some time
<tarruda>
but it is not working, still wrapping my head at how macros are evaluated
<pjb>
tarruda: if you insert an argument in a position in the expansion where it is not evaluated, then it won't be evaluated, and vice-versa.
<pjb>
If you put it in a position defining a name for a new binding, then a new binding it will be.
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<cgay>
tarruda: Maybe you can paste a short example of what you tried and what you expected.
<TMA>
tarruda: the rules are really simple (except for the fine print). first, take the arguments to the macro call unevaluated. then pass them to the macro body. whatever it returns is the new code that shall be evaluated instead of the macro
<tarruda>
What I'm doing is simple, as an excercise I'm implementing a recursive descent parser
<pjb>
tarruda: you're creating a symbol named |parse-SOMETHING|.
<tarruda>
my goal is to implement the parser functions using the "defrule" macro
<pjb>
tarruda: beware that (symbol-name 'foo) #| --> "FOO" |# by default, since the default reader settings are to upcase the symbol names.
<tarruda>
which automatically inserts code to check if the input is at EOF
<tarruda>
ok thanks for the pointer
<tarruda>
what about param-list
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<pjb>
tarruda: (equal (length x) 0) == (zerop (length x)) and assumes that x is bound to a sequence (a list or a vector (including strings)).
<tarruda>
yes, the input will be a string
<pjb>
param-list is not in a position to be evaluated in the expansion. So it won't be evaluated.
<pjb>
(if test nil something) == (unless test something)
<TMA>
tarruda: actually you are repeatedly defining the function |parse-%s|, because FORMAT uses ~s not %s, % is just an ordinary character for FORMAT
<pjb>
Notably when something is several expressions like in ,@body. In a if you'd need progn : (if test (progn ,@body1) (progn ,@body2))
<pjb>
Yes, too :-)
<pjb>
Unless you're writing an emacs lisp macro, in which case it's ok.
<tarruda>
my goal is to define a `parse-ordinary` function, which automatically has code to detect if input length is 0
<tarruda>
if the input argument is 0, it should return nil
<dmiles>
<pjb> param-list is not in a position to be evaluated in the expansion. So it won't be evaluated.
<dmiles>
tarruda: that is in fact what you wanted?
<pjb>
tarruda: do you want your parameter list to be always a single mandatory parameter?
<tarruda>
since I'm defining a lot of functions similar to this one, I wanted to abstract this input length check in the macro, not sure if this is the best approach
<tarruda>
pjb: no, I want the caller of `defrule` to determine the paramters, but it will always have at least one argument: the input string
<tarruda>
that is why I'm invoking (car param-list)
<dmiles>
i think perhaps you migh tneed a couple more comma
<tarruda>
so it will work no matter what symbol is used to define the input argument
<TMA>
tarruda: at present the use is equivalent to: (defun |parse-%s| param-list (if (equal (length input 0) nil (list (substring input 1 nil) (list 'literal (aref input 0))))))
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<pierpa>
dmiles: I don't need it for what I'm working on now. But it's a useful tool to keep in my toolbox.
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<pierpa>
dmiles: in currently accepted terminology, chess is not a game of chance. Those are games which employs dice or a shuffled deck of cards. Chess is exactly *the opposite* of a game of chance.