ArmbianHelper changed the topic of #armbian to: armbian - Linux for ARM development boards | Armbian 20.11 Tamandua released | | Github: | Commits: #armbian-commits | Developer talk: #armbian-devel | Forum feed: #armbian-rss | Type 'help' for help | Logs: ->
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<lanefu> sup turds
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<archetech> not much POS
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<qCactus> Hi everyone! I'm trying to get armbian to run on an Allwinner R40-based devboard that currently does not have a known config for it. While I'm tinkering (not very fruitfully) with u-boot and DRAM settings to get it to load, I'd also like to test out Armbian itself by piggybacking on the vendor's bootloader.
<qCactus> How do I compile just the OS image, so that I could then dd it in place of the manufacturer-provided one?
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<IgorPec> regarding radnom R40 board can't help, but for building armbian proceed here
<IgorPec> qcactus: try asking in #linux-sunxi if anyone is working on R40
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<qCactus> IgorPec: I'm already there, digging inside uboot's guts with the chat.
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<Manouchehri> so question, does /etc/default/armbian-ramlog being enabled cause the system logs to *never* be written anywhere to disk?
<IgorPec> not exactly never. logs are written to sd at shutdown which is far less stresfull than continous access
<IgorPec> in the mean time, they resist in compressed memory
<Manouchehri> hmm, where are they written to? If I do like `journalctl`, I only see logs up until when I last booted up.
<IgorPec> var/log.hdd i think
<IgorPec> i think this was discussed in details
<IgorPec> do you think its not working properly?
<Manouchehri> when I do `journalctl` on my laptop, I get logs from months ago :)
<IgorPec> if you don't want to kill sd card, you need to fine tune filesystem
<Manouchehri> right, but just wondering why I see no logs older than my current boot :/
<IgorPec> several things are different and not very well tuned as on x86 world
<IgorPec> sorry, i meant to say .. here are better optimised due to lack of resources
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<Manouchehri> pretty sure it's the same on my arm server too (which runs stock ubuntu)
<Manouchehri> can't check because it got unplugged by mistake :/
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<IgorPec> its not arm vs x86
<IgorPec> ubuntu is not good enough
<Xogium> debian till 11, and ubuntu used to store persistent logs via syslog, not via journalctl
<Xogium> this is why you only see logs from the current boot in journalctl
<Xogium> I don't know if ubuntu changed this
<Xogium> if you wanted persistent logs from journalctl, just create /var/log/journal directory, systemd will do the rest
<IgorPec> i think we disable this by purpose, but not completly sure
<IgorPec> in efforts with "logging and writing to SD to minimum"
<Xogium> well, as I said debian up to bullseye did this, so you technically probably didn't have to do anything
<Xogium> but might want to do it starting from bullseye
<IgorPec> we cover both and future versions are also in the works
<Xogium> that's very good
<Xogium> but yep even syslog isn't that efficient
<Xogium> for sd card
<Xogium> I don't know how it writes logs, but I suppose it doesn't buffer up anything at all and directly writes to disk
<IgorPec> it doesn't get there since its intercepted by zram
<Xogium> journald at least buffer up and writes to ram, then sync to disk ever 10 minutes I believe. Not ideal yet, but better
<Xogium> ah and yeah ram
<IgorPec> yes, that's better for sure
<Xogium> it could also be changed to sync to disk every hour or so
<IgorPec> its once per day by default i think
<IgorPec> in armbian tweak
<Xogium> that's not bad
<IgorPec> yeah, well, our defaults are pretty fine tuned.
<Xogium> and for curious peeps, I tested f2fs extensively over the last 2 weeks
<Xogium> on paper that fs looks nice, but in practice…
<IgorPec> don't have any experiences
<Xogium> if you create it with a kernel older or more recent than the one you plan on using in the target, it can fail to mount it proper
<Xogium> the fsck is also pretty darn weak and leads to a lot of data corruption due to power outages
<Xogium> and often performances over ext4 are even worse
<IgorPec> what should be its key advantage?
<Xogium> it's supposed to be friendlier to flash storage
<Xogium> as in, the flash that has a ftl already in, like sd card, eMMC and ssd
<Xogium> does less writes, and when it has to write it does it with as large a chunk as possible to minimize the number of writes
<IgorPec> we mitigate biggest flaws of ext4, so there is not so much need
<Xogium> but if the price for that to pay is a filesystem that you can't trust at the slightest power outage…
<Xogium> meh
<IgorPec> this is exactly what we do
<IgorPec> and this problem is also here
<Xogium> aye, sure
<IgorPec> power outage is not nice ;)
<Xogium> oh sure isn't
<Xogium> but ext4 isn't so weak
<IgorPec> i was thinking toward ubifs once
<Xogium> like I cut the power on purpose, and f2fs's own fsck failed to recognize the filesystem
<IgorPec> at least for boot partition
<Xogium> after one single outage
<IgorPec> haha
<IgorPec> that's bad.
<Xogium> yup
<Xogium> well ubifs would work but only with raw nand or nor flash
<IgorPec> here - in that happens - you lost data that was not stored, it doesn't crash
<Xogium> yeah that is much, much safer
<IgorPec> aha, so we could use it just for NOR flash
<Xogium> I believe so yeah, that's the intended purpose of that sort of fs, just like jffs2
<Xogium> they are intended to work with devices that don't even have a block layer
<Xogium> and they have to handle wear leveling themselves
<Xogium> just like you couldn't put an ext4 fs on a raw flash
<IgorPec> got it
<Xogium> never worked with raw flash, and I hope to never have to do it in my life XD
<IgorPec> hehe
<Xogium> well not exactly true I worked with it on only one board, espressobin, for the bootloader. But since u-boot had a nice command to flash the bootloader the exact way it needed to be flashed, I didn't have to worry about the offset and etc
<IgorPec> but many of those boards has some spi nor flash
<IgorPec> some soldered, somewhere you need to add it
<Xogium> yea
<Xogium> mine has none but I've been thinking many times it would be a nice place to store up a firmware for the m4 coprocessor
<Xogium> but I never got around to it
<Xogium> some place that doesn't depend on the main storage
<IgorPec> i didn't played much around here, also lost interest for espressobin
<Xogium> you were the one making the armbian port for it, right ?
<Xogium> problem with ebin is that the vendor itself didn't care about the hardware
<IgorPec> no, i was not involved much in ebin
<Xogium> surely the last time I buy something from globalscale :p my ebin is still working good so far, and I'll keep it around for as long as it lives I guess
<Xogium> kind of sucks though because it is like the only sbc I saw that had real potential as a router
<IgorPec> ebin hw was released in terrible state
<IgorPec> yeah, the only among cheap ones
<IgorPec> solid run's routers are in much better shape
<Xogium> but yeah, seen lots of folks having problems with theirs. For me the v5 was the most stable revision of the board I ever saw. It never crashed or went crazy with thermal, even though it was very high temperature range
<Xogium> only time it crashed was with their crappy ubuntu port
<IgorPec> i have two here, but sadly both are the same version
<IgorPec> forgot which one
<Xogium> ran fine idling for 3 hours or so then out of the blue, kernel panic. I went back to mainline kernel lol
<Xogium> I've been very lucky with mine, been running for 3 years almost, and no issue so far ;) I remotely get in and flash new firmware I make with buildroot once a month or so
<IgorPec> mainline support is the only hope. but the problem is to cover all hw revisions that are floating around
<IgorPec> that's a bummer
<Xogium> yep
<IgorPec> probably some have design flaws beyond repair
<Xogium> heh I'm sure
<IgorPec> in normal world, you trash such device
<IgorPec> :)
<Xogium> but for my usage, the 2 v5 I got work awesomely. I don't really run them at their max speed though, the connection they are providing from is not even a 100 mbit/s
<Xogium> but yeah, for what I do with them, they were decent
<Xogium> I haven't got any connection that would jusitfy getting some solidrun hw
<Xogium> justify
<Xogium> it'd be some damn impressive overkill lol
<Xogium> been curious also about the turi mox or turi omnia buut I never bought one
<Xogium> their website is complete trash for blind people anyway, so I couldn't even customize the hw
<IgorPec> we are well stock with older clearfog
<IgorPec> armada A380
<IgorPec> which is also in Helios4
<Xogium> hah, runs good ?
<IgorPec> that one is quite old now ... yes, it runs well
<IgorPec> its the same design as thurris omnia
<Xogium> well, old is fine in my book, as long as it perform whatever you aks of it good
<IgorPec> or lets say very similar
<Xogium> *ask
<IgorPec> A380 is bigger brother of A3700
<Xogium> oh, I see
<Xogium> I got tempted by a mcbin but when I saw that even at that price they had't protected the uart to usb converter on board with some diodes to prevent power flowing from tx to gnd, I quickly changed my mind
<IgorPec> yeah, i saw that flaw :)
<IgorPec> software support is unknown ... in theory it looks nice
<Xogium> I mean guys, its not a $20 board, it's like what, $500 ?
<Xogium> something like that anyway
<Xogium> so come on lol
<IgorPec> if you have such use case ...
<IgorPec> BOM determines base price
<Xogium> yeah, but would it have really made a big difference if they had put on some diodes…
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<IgorPec> agree, but probably such issues are fixed later i guerss
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<Xogium> I damn hope so
<IgorPec> we worked in the 1st hummingboard era and i still have around 3versions
<Xogium> ahah
<Xogium> friend of me has one where the ethernet just drops off for some reason
<Xogium> eth0 simply disappears
<IgorPec> every 6 months they send updated version :)
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<jschwart> Xogium: I just got an Omnia, it is very nice, devs are also active in #turris in case you have questions
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