ArmbianHelper changed the topic of #armbian to: armbian - Linux for ARM development boards | Armbian 20.11 Tamandua released | www.armbian.com | Github: github.com/armbian | Commits: #armbian-commits | Developer talk: #armbian-devel | Forum feed: #armbian-rss | Type 'help' for help | Logs: -> irc.armbian.com
<stipa>
i dont like the new look of the forum
<IgorPec>
we have new look?
<stipa>
yeah
<stipa>
you have to clikc right
<stipa>
at right side what you want
<stipa>
last tim i posted i got [Invalid]
<IgorPec>
hmm
<buZz>
there's a forum?
<buZz>
why would you need a forum for a irc channel
<buZz>
mangix: i asked about comparing C++ to C , is C++ higher or lower level?
<stipa>
mangix: that's all fancy
<mangix>
both. C code can be compiled as C++
<buZz>
stipa: its a full 'laptop' for children
<stipa>
if it can be fast and at least functional noone will complain
<buZz>
mangix: why dont you just respond to my question
<stipa>
never saw that one
<buZz>
it didnt sell outside US
<buZz>
i had to import a pile of em
<buZz>
imported 16 , sold 10, now i own 6 of em for free
<stipa>
oh
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<stipa>
and you run arch on them?
<mangix>
buZz: I can't tell if you're trolling at this point
<buZz>
mangix: i figured
<mangix>
C++ is a tool. It depends on how you use it.
<buZz>
stipa: no, that was the chromebook i talked about
<buZz>
C++ is a language
<mangix>
and a language is a what?
<stipa>
mangix: buZz c++ is just an ASM with bunch of functions
<buZz>
not really
<buZz>
stipa: this is a 'zipit z2' , its kinda rare , but a nice kidstoy with semimodern linux for it available, OpenWRT is what i run on it usually, but debian , gentoo, voidlinux images exist
<buZz>
even ubuntu i think?
<buZz>
but just 32MB ram , so pretty hard
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<stipa>
hmmmm
<stipa>
have you tried tiny linux?
<stipa>
or micro linux
<buZz>
never even heard of
<stipa>
tinyore
<buZz>
very unlikely to be more minimal than OpenWRT ;)
<stipa>
micro maybe
<stipa>
its just cli
<buZz>
i can boot with 5.x kernel and have a fully operational system with GUI and wifi with under 5MB memory used
<stipa>
oh wow
<stipa>
you cold put that on an apple watch
<buZz>
highly doubt anyone can put anything on a apple anything
<buZz>
Triffid_Hunter: oh the 'omg my SSD died within a year' laptop
<Triffid_Hunter>
buZz: M1 hasn't been out for a year..?
<buZz>
it -was- funny that corellium 'ported the iphone linux to M1' within a week just to fuck with marcan
<buZz>
:D
<stipa>
linux will be popular in a 5 years when appele drops support for it
<buZz>
i dont care
<stipa>
for the M1
<buZz>
apple is completely irrelevant here
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: haha, apple RiscV next?
<stipa>
Triffid_Hunter: idk man
<stipa>
that chip is some shit
<stipa>
it has usb4 in it
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<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: RiscV is a core, it doesn't have peripherals.. those are provided by vendors implementing the core into actual chips
<buZz>
i got a ESP32-C3 at home
<buZz>
espressif's first (iirc) RiscV
<stipa>
Triffid_Hunter: cpu core is open, peripherals aren, peripherals are chips aound the core that for the usable computer system
<buZz>
lol
<buZz>
might wanna google who Triffid_Hunter is
<Triffid_Hunter>
What, I'm famous now?
<stipa>
i wont
<stipa>
i'm too cocky
<buZz>
hehe, well, at least not a newbie :P
<stipa>
forever noob
<stipa>
so
<stipa>
whre was i wrong again?
<buZz>
no clue, have at it , i'm gonna sleep :)
<stipa>
buZz: gn
<stipa>
Triffid_Hunter: where was i wrong ?
<stipa>
ok
<stipa>
cpu core is open
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: RiscV is not a specific chip. it's a design for a processor core, which can be put onto chips
<stipa>
riscV
<stipa>
Triffid_Hunter:
<stipa>
ok
<Triffid_Hunter>
and the manufacturers can put whatever they like around it on the same silicon wafer
<stipa>
cou is open but we have to connect something to it
<stipa>
cpu*
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: yeah, and the things connected to it so far are mostly proprietary
<stipa>
yeah
<Triffid_Hunter>
so until 100% of the peripherals around the core are also open, RiscV is just an open core, not an open chip ;)
<stipa>
man, maybe i should google you
<stipa>
give me a sec
<stipa>
ok ok
<stipa>
3D printers
<stipa>
CNC
<stipa>
i give up
<stipa>
i never had a 3D printer in life
<stipa>
or CNC
<stipa>
you won Triffid_Hunter
<Triffid_Hunter>
I haven't touched one in a while
<stipa>
i'll kneel in front of you
<stipa>
it's not a problem
<stipa>
i obey
<stipa>
my master
<Triffid_Hunter>
uhh ok stop groveling, go make cool shit :P
<stipa>
idk man
<stipa>
you know what makes me horny?
<[TheBug]>
anyone who touches your pee pee
<stipa>
no no
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: rusty spoons?
* stipa
gets horny when it hears metal printing!
<[TheBug]>
hmm, guessing then you have a hard time getting laid..
<stipa>
:(
<stipa>
i feel verbaly molsted now
<stipa>
maybe it's time for me to earn some money on freenode and sue people...
<stipa>
[TheBug]: will be the first successful case
<[TheBug]>
rofl
* stipa
ggmgmgmgmmg
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<stipa>
Triffid_Hunter: man
<stipa>
how much would cost getting in metal printing
<stipa>
on cheap
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: I guess you could get a K40 or something from china and put a powder bed and a windscreen wiper in it
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: depends what metal you want to print, some take more laser power than others
<tparys>
evening all
<stipa>
i guess softer metals take less power
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: specifics are googleable :P might need specific laser colours too
<stipa>
colors
<stipa>
tparys: hi
<stipa>
arent all colors sining the same power Triffid_Hunter ?
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: sure, but some metals reflect some colours more than others
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: and if it's being reflected, it's not making the metal hot
<stipa>
fuckin shit
<stipa>
i didn't know that
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: that's why eg copper and gold have distinctive visible colours :P
<stipa>
so black metals are the best for that kind of stuff?
<stipa>
like painting metals in black...
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: the paint will vaporise and leave the metal beneath largely untouched
<tparys>
physics works against you. like grapes end up being just about the right size to resonate with microwaves and make plasma
<Triffid_Hunter>
tparys: heh, and tennis balls are almost invisible to 40kHz sonar
<stipa>
tparys: yeah, mate, everything resonates
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: I'm no expert in lasering metals, but those are a few things I'd check before diving in
<stipa>
fuck it mate Triffid_Hunter
<stipa>
from my videos i watched and are floating through my head
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: might be simpler to just bolt a MIG welder to a conventional CNC?
<stipa>
i would say that plasma cutting is most efficent
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: sure, but that's not 3d printing metal
<stipa>
it's cutting
<stipa>
the piece of metal rather than building it
<stipa>
but the question is
<stipa>
is it better build synthetically or the ways nature build it and it's carved out after
<stipa>
what's more rigid?
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: nature's generally pretty crap at making single crystal metals
<stipa>
are we talking diamonds?
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: diamonds are carbon, not metal
<stipa>
oh
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: they burn and everything
<stipa>
i see there's lot's of pressure in the media towards carbon
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: well pumping CO and CO2 into the atmosphere turns out to not be great for life
<stipa>
graphene and carbon, are they related?
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: sure, graphene is a 2d sheet structure of carbon atoms, just like diamonds are a 3d tetrahedonal structure of carbon atoms
<stipa>
graphene strucutre is mad of carbon, right?
<stipa>
but
<stipa>
in media the connection breaks
<stipa>
betweene carbon and solid state
<stipa>
batteries
<Triffid_Hunter>
most journalists aren't good at science unfortunately
<stipa>
i beleive that
<stipa>
idk
<stipa>
some country
<stipa>
by the 2030
<stipa>
wants to expell fuel
<stipa>
from the economy
<stipa>
nokia
<stipa>
or swiss
<stipa>
not sure
<stipa>
how are they going to di it if it's not physically possible?
<stipa>
Triffid_Hunter: do you have any idea?
<Triffid_Hunter>
make everything electric..?
<stipa>
yeah
<stipa>
that's the idea
<stipa>
but, can it be done?
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: sure, except rocketry.. aviation will be a tough one though
<stipa>
oh, i meant only on land traffic
<stipa>
but ok
<stipa>
makes sense
<stipa>
i guess nothing electric can lift rocket in air...
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: nah that's the aviation aspect - it's moving things outside air that's the problem
<stipa>
yeah, in vacum it woks ok
<stipa>
but lifiting it in zero G with electricity
<stipa>
it'll wait some time
<Triffid_Hunter>
I mean, we have ion engines, but those just use a crapton of electricity to throw xenon particles out the back - and xenon in this case is technically fuel ;)
<stipa>
don't be mad at me Triffid_Hunter
<stipa>
but the best thing is nuclear energy
<stipa>
Voyager is still sending signals
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: sure, hard to manage though
<stipa>
why, we have nuclear power plants all over the world, one is sending this message to free node right now
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: I mean for rockets travelinga around the solar system.. terrestrial ones are fine if they're designed properly and not messed with
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<stipa>
well i guess
<stipa>
if you want to send a chunky signal
<stipa>
across the solar system
<stipa>
it takes some heat
<stipa>
right?
<Triffid_Hunter>
sure
<stipa>
nuclear energy is not so bad if it doesn't go wrong
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: yeah, and all the nuclear disasters were either poor design or people messing with it way too much
<stipa>
nuclear bombs or in case of russia who knows where they got idea for nucelar energy
<stipa>
Triffid_Hunter: right
<stipa>
it can be used for good or for wrong
<Triffid_Hunter>
I mean, many will rightly point out that fukishima was triggered by a major natural disaster, but the reactors could have survived if they had the coolant storage above the reactor rather than below
<Triffid_Hunter>
or had done their electrical wiring a bit differently
<stipa>
even those complaints are questionable
<stipa>
idk, but i guess, i din't do a research, rhere's a bunch of nuclear plants
<stipa>
all over the world
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: france is full of them
<stipa>
providing electricity to people
<stipa>
Triffid_Hunter: i know france by the wine
<stipa>
like it's the best there
<Triffid_Hunter>
stipa: heh I prefer australian or chilean wines over any french wine I've tried
<stipa>
i've seen some fany islands
<stipa>
fancy*
<stipa>
with some questionable stuff
<stipa>
whre sun shines and is enough water for plants to stay hydrated
<stipa>
like two exremes
<stipa>
that stuff there doesn't go the the worl markets
<stipa>
world*
<stipa>
to*
<stipa>
maybe it's wort the trip
<stipa>
-- Policija kod Daruvara rastjerala petoricu muškaraca koji su pili pivo ispred dućana
<ArmbianHelper>
Police near Daruvar dispersed five men who were drinking beer in front of the store [hr~>eng]
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<stipa>
i'm planning to get nanopi neo3
<stipa>
drill holes on the housing and the power adapter, screw them together and plug it in the wall
<stipa>
stick some mediatek usb AC wifi in it
<stipa>
and hope for the best
<mrjpaxton[m]>
Mediatek and Realtek Wi-Fi are always hit or miss on Debian, and therefore Armbian as well.
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<stipa>
mt67
<stipa>
it'sin the kernel
<stipa>
sorry
<stipa>
mt76*
<stipa>
MT7610U chip
<stipa>
usb3
<mrjpaxton[m]>
I still swear by ath9k and ath9k-htc, but those devices are getting harder to come by, nowadays. :(
<stipa>
of course, i would buy some ax chips but there aren0t any, atleas usb ones
<mrjpaxton[m]>
Basic laws of physics and chemistry will tell you that doubling the frequency will also require more power to get the same range (not necessarily double power). Because it's a shorter wavelength (higher frequency), it will also travel a shorter distance on the same amount of power you give it. Hence why I still use 2.4 GHz, since it can travel farther.
<mrjpaxton[m]>
Though I guess not always an option if those three general channels 2.4 GHz lives on are congested a lot.
<stipa>
idk man
<stipa>
i feel like i'm coocking at 2.4 G
<stipa>
like i'm in a microwave
<mangix>
mrjpaxton[m]: main ath9k developer is working in mt76 now
<mangix>
*on
<mrjpaxton[m]>
Yeah, it still only supports like up to 40mbps, which equates to 5MB/s.
<mrjpaxton[m]>
So it can be a bit slow....
<mrjpaxton[m]>
I hope someday we can get FOSS Wireless AC firmware. At least we are starting to get some good drivers though. I hope rtw88 will improve even more.
<mrjpaxton[m]>
I have a PC that uses the RTL8822BE device.
<stipa>
yeah, rtls are fine
<mrjpaxton[m]>
But I don't think I've tried MediaTek, or even ath10k yet.
<stipa>
but no suport for VLAN
<stipa>
i dodnt try mediatek
<stipa>
but i feel it's the new atheros
<stipa>
didn't
<stipa>
*
<mrjpaxton[m]>
I have a feeling Mediatek is still as stingy as the rest. But I hope they prove me wrong.
<stipa>
and it's cheap
<stipa>
mrjpaxton[m]: there has to be something about it when it's in the mainline
<mangix>
i mean
<mrjpaxton[m]>
I almost wonder if the FCC and other regulatory systems are trying to push people to make Wi-Fi firmware proprietary so they can control what legal frequencies people are allowed to broadcast on. I'm not sure....
<mangix>
when the main developer of ath9k moves to mt76, that should say something
<mrjpaxton[m]>
I don't wanna make any conspiracies though. Lol.
<mangix>
mediatek is actually pretty FOSS friendly
<mrjpaxton[m]>
mangix: I really hope you are right, but it's one guy who has to try to convince a large company to release the firmware as open source. It's really not gonna be that easy.
<mangix>
a lot of mediatek employees contribute to OpenWrt
<stipa>
i hope mediatek will pump on the market some ax usb chips
<mangix>
mrjpaxton[m]: open source firmware is a lost cause at this point. the only hope at this point is for small firmware that doesn't do much
<mangix>
mediatek firmware is tiny compared to qualcomm, marvell, realtek, intel
<mangix>
mediatek's ARM division is different than their wifi division
<stipa>
mangix: mediatek is arm?
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<mangix>
stipa: they have MIPS stuff
<[TheBug]>
stipa: if you mean does Mediatek have ARM SoC's then the answer is yes
<[TheBug]>
I have a phone with one in fact atm
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<stipa>
i means: is mediatek owned by arm?
<[TheBug]>
MediaTek was originally a unit of the Taiwanese firm, United Microelectronics Corporation (UMC), tasked with designing chipsets for home entertainment products. On May 28, 1997, the unit was spun off and incorporated. MediaTek Inc. was listed on the Taiwan Stock Exchange (TSEC) under the "2454" code on July 23, 2001.
<lanefu>
they were fined several million for spelling Tech incorrectly
<stipa>
lol
<stipa>
what kind of idiot would sue them because of that?
<stipa>
ha ha
<stipa>
don't tell it, oyu could be fined beacuse of it
<stipa>
just pathetic
<stipa>
you have so much smart people doing that chips
<stipa>
and than you have some kind of idiot
<stipa>
that don't know to speel it's name
<stipa>
doing bullshit to survive
<stipa>
pathetic
<stipa>
who cares if someone doesn't spell sometinh right
<stipa>
especeally a company from china that have
<stipa>
completely different system of writing
<stipa>
so idiotic
<stipa>
the court is idiotic even more
<stipa>
that make the decision
<stipa>
made*
<stipa>
but, if they were me
<stipa>
they wouldn't be on hte market anymore
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<stipa>
mangix: yeah ,seems like Felix Fietkau is workingon mediatek wifi chips
<stipa>
that video is 6 years old
<mangix>
stipa: he's still working on it
<mangix>
lol
<stipa>
mangix: seems like it, yeah
<stipa>
i'll try the ac usb chip
<stipa>
i need to restock
<mangix>
I have one. Works great on Linux. Terrible on Windows
<stipa>
yeah, rarely anything works at it should on windows
<mangix>
:)
<stipa>
\o/
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<e3ef13f4ff44>
hello, how are works going on opi zero 2?
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<HerculeP>
lanefu, IgorPec: I installed Armbian_21.05.0-trunk.32_Odroidc2_focal_current_5.10.19_mate_desktop.img on my ETH aware device, old "no reboot" issue :(
<HerculeP>
reverted to armbian 25.02.0-trunk.125 (kernel 5.10.17): reboot works
<buZz>
25 sounds newer than 21
<buZz>
but that might be me
<HerculeP>
err 21.02.0 ofc
<buZz>
:)
<HerculeP>
2025.02 is far away ;)
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<halabso>
hii
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<HerculeP>
odroidc2 ubuntu mate 21.02.125.0-trunk: usb hotplug, HDMI sound, both do work well :)
<HerculeP>
21.02.0-trunk.125 even
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<Qen-Joana>
Hey chan! I'm using the latest Armbian Buster on Odroid-HC4. I just used "install full firmware" from armbian-config but the app I need (OpenVPN UI) is saying it needs additional privileges. Any ideas? ;)
<Qen-Joana>
I have researched the error itself and it is only referenced by my OpenVPN UI (Eddie) but I'm sure apps needing additional privileges is possible to fix and not simply a bug. Eddie works fine on 3 other PCs, just not Armbian so far. The Eddie is an ARM64 build for Debian.
<IgorPec>
Qen-Joana: "eddie" has nothing to do with armbian. I don't even know what that is
<IgorPec>
perhaps they don't support arm64 well or not at all
<Qen-Joana>
IgorPec, I believe it may be a compatibility issue due to the modification of Debian for Armbian, or perhaps there is something missing from the kernel that Eddie needs.
<IgorPec>
could be. but its on you to research that
<IgorPec>
btw. modifications on Armbian side are minimal and there are almost no reports on the compatibility issues
<IgorPec>
on the userland level
<IgorPec>
regarding kernel - most of the features are enabled
<Qen-Joana>
That is just unsociable. I am a biologist, not a computer scientist. Why learn the full workings of Armbian when others know it fully and comprehensively and can dramatically reduce my research time?
<IgorPec>
hire someone
<Qen-Joana>
FOSS.
<IgorPec>
???
<IgorPec>
its free of licence
<Qen-Joana>
Are you saying this IRC chan exists so I can hire people?
<IgorPec>
that's my advice to you
<IgorPec>
cause i can't afford to pay for your problem
<Qen-Joana>
How about I give you $200/hr to grow some social consciousness?
<IgorPec>
nope
<Qen-Joana>
It must cost more than that for you to 'grow up' a bit.
<IgorPec>
or you. you are asking for R&D here
<Qen-Joana>
That is definitely a lie.
<IgorPec>
or support, whatever this is called
<Qen-Joana>
I am asking about elevating privileges for an app aside from sudo: general advice.
<Werner>
Hey
<Qen-Joana>
Hello, Werner.
<Werner>
Got my nvme+nvme adapter for pbp. just moving stuff from emmc to it :D
<IgorPec>
so you are asking at the wrong place. i didn't create or seel you this app
<Qen-Joana>
IgorPec, You can ignore I then. You have spent more time lying to I and arguing than it would take an expert to lead me to the answer.
<Werner>
openvpn needs root to work properly. I guess the mentioned app simply asks for root when starting it. The other idea would be to create a similar app that starts without but would ask for root as soon as sombody tries to establish a vpn connection
<IgorPec>
this is chat, so we can talk
<Qen-Joana>
Thanks, Werner !
<Werner>
there MIGHT be hacks around there to give nonprivieleged users some kind of access to tun device but I never researched into this myself and is just a pure guess.
<Werner>
Maybe try start it with gksudo (assuming a desktop app??) and add nopasswd for the command?
<Qen-Joana>
I will try all of that!
<Werner>
good luck
<Qen-Joana>
Thank you, Werner.
<Xogium>
iirc arch has a special openvpn user/group which is a member of another group
<Xogium>
for networking
archetech has joined #armbian
<Xogium>
but I'm not sure 100% of that
<Werner>
could be
<Qen-Joana>
Xogium, I know that there is an CLI app (addon) called "hummingbird" that makes a new user, perhaps that is what you are referring to. It is relatively new.
<Werner>
Xogium, might be their way to implement the hack I mentioned above?
<Werner>
hm nand sata install should have mentioned that it needs a spi uboot image beforehand -.-
<Qen-Joana>
I do not wish to argue with you anymore.
<IgorPec>
i treat you how you treat me
<Qen-Joana>
Goodbye, IgorPec .
<IgorPec>
going somewhere?:)
<Werner>
aaaand I killed my rootfs
<IgorPec>
rm -rf / ?
<IgorPec>
dd
<Werner>
Not sure yet. investigating
<Werner>
Interesting. After another reboot it booted from nvme. seems fine but has some errors when booting. also I had my home directory on sdcard encrypted with luks. Seems like the script killed it. It stats it is no valid LUKS device
<Werner>
Not a big loss though, everything has been copied to the nvme...now unencrypted
<IgorPec>
this is booting from spi now?
<Werner>
no
<Werner>
I dont know how to create or where to get a spi uboot imgae